3 ms·

Those things happen in markets with price signals too. Rationing and persistent shortage are happening in housing markets around the world broadly. It's kind

Those things happen in markets with price signals too. Rationing and persistent shortage are happening in housing markets around the world broadly. It's kind of a given that any social housing like this is going to have a limited number of rooms. And as a result, only so many people will be able to live there. That's not some clear proof of market theory. Because the other half of market theory - about how price signals drive behavior of rational actors - doesn't hold up.

thebean11 5y ago
Do you have an example where rationing is occurring without price controls? I don't have experience outside of the US, but in the two US markets with probably the biggest housing shortages (SF, NYC, maybe Austin nowadays?), if you give me 8k a month I'll find an apartment tomorrow.
- syshum 5y ago
  It is also unfair to blame market prices for the situation in NYC and SF as largely the price increases and shortages are driven by insane zoning and other regulations that makes building, maintaining, and turning over housing near impossible. That is not market forces, that is government controls
- lakis 5y ago
  Good luck going to Mount Athos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos#Access https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos#Access Money is not an issue. But unless your a man, you can't get in, period. Oh, you mean you want to live there. No problem, just change your religion. "Residents on the peninsula must be men aged 18 and over who are members of the Eastern Orthodox Church and also either monks or workers"
  - nanis 5y ago
    > Good luck going to Mount Athos OK, so here we once again have a situation where the price mechanism is not allowed to operate. For a moment, I thought this was a private gated community in San Fransisco. > Mount Athos (/ˈæθɒs/; Greek: Άθως, [ˈa.θos]) is a mountain and peninsula in northeastern Greece and an important centre of Eastern Orthodox monasticism. It is governed as an autonomous polity within the Hellenic Republic. Mount Athos is home to 20 monasteries under the direct jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople. Oh, another religious membership test. How is this at all pertinent to the functioning of the price mechanism? Especially when it is government enforced? > Although Mount Athos is legally part of the European Union like the rest of Greece, the Monastic State of the Holy Mountain and the Athonite institutions have a special jurisdiction which was reaffirmed during the admission of Greece to the European Community (precursor to the EU).[5] This empowers the Monastic State's authorities to regulate the free movement of people and goods in its territory; in particular, only males are allowed to enter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos

thebean11 5y ago

Do you have an example where rationing is occurring without price controls? I don't have experience outside of the US, but in the two US markets with probably the biggest housing shortages (SF, NYC, maybe Austin nowadays?), if you give me 8k a month I'll find an apartment tomorrow.

syshum 5y ago
It is also unfair to blame market prices for the situation in NYC and SF as largely the price increases and shortages are driven by insane zoning and other regulations that makes building, maintaining, and turning over housing near impossible. That is not market forces, that is government controls
lakis 5y ago
Good luck going to Mount Athos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos#Access https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos#Access Money is not an issue. But unless your a man, you can't get in, period. Oh, you mean you want to live there. No problem, just change your religion. "Residents on the peninsula must be men aged 18 and over who are members of the Eastern Orthodox Church and also either monks or workers"
- nanis 5y ago
  > Good luck going to Mount Athos OK, so here we once again have a situation where the price mechanism is not allowed to operate. For a moment, I thought this was a private gated community in San Fransisco. > Mount Athos (/ˈæθɒs/; Greek: Άθως, [ˈa.θos]) is a mountain and peninsula in northeastern Greece and an important centre of Eastern Orthodox monasticism. It is governed as an autonomous polity within the Hellenic Republic. Mount Athos is home to 20 monasteries under the direct jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople. Oh, another religious membership test. How is this at all pertinent to the functioning of the price mechanism? Especially when it is government enforced? > Although Mount Athos is legally part of the European Union like the rest of Greece, the Monastic State of the Holy Mountain and the Athonite institutions have a special jurisdiction which was reaffirmed during the admission of Greece to the European Community (precursor to the EU).[5] This empowers the Monastic State's authorities to regulate the free movement of people and goods in its territory; in particular, only males are allowed to enter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Athos