5 ms·

Universities mostly no longer teach anything worth the tuition. Jobs pay less than what would be required to make university a positive ROI! Maybe STEM but on

Universities mostly no longer teach anything worth the tuition. Jobs pay less than what would be required to make university a positive ROI! Maybe STEM but only engineering and comp sci but no more than 10% of the general population has the constitution and thinking for being those. Most should no more be in STEM than I should be an English major! A degree in astrophysics is about as valuable - most have to figure out how to program or do some type of engineering-oriented job. (Science is discovery of how the universe works for the purpose of pure knowledge - zero direct economic value; engineering is application of science to human utility and value - MAJOR direct economic value. Right now the winning strategy is the trades - the massive shortage in tradesmen (it's 99% men because women do not want these jobs) is the only economically bright option: no debt, make money while in apprenticeship, make good money with just some commitment. It's a no brainer. Electrical wiring, plumbing, Construction, etc. is NOT going away but people qualified to do these are disappearing simply because they are retiring and/or dying.

paulpauper 5y ago
Not true. The college wage premium even for the liberal arts is wide enough to make college worthwhile even after accounting for student loan debt. The trades req. certification and training which can be expensive and time consuming. A degree does not require as much maintence as certification.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  It is possible that was true over previous decades, and has changed recently, but is not yet reflected in the data.
  - paulpauper 5y ago
    There is little reason or evidence to suggest it has changed.
devwastaken 5y ago
Yep, universities are cash cows funded with taxes, no incentives to compete, and artificially filled with bogus classes to up tuition costs. Sadly if you don't live in a major tech city, you either join the uni cult or get treated as an outsider. Cancel student loans.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  > Cancel student loans. Cancel all government subsidies via taxpayer guaranteed loans. All they do is distort the market and enrich the vendors.
- paulpauper 5y ago
  The problem is jobs reqiring degrees even if the work does not require it. Maybe this means higher quality of employees but at the same time leads to more demand for college and more debt.
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    That is a symptom of the problem of excess supply of labor in relation to demand. The solution would require adjusting the supply of labor and/or demand for that type of labor.
  - devwastaken 5y ago
    They won't if people can't get them. Make unis go bankrupt and close, replace with education that works and matters.
bawolff 5y ago
If someone is self-taught, i think its more likely than average they care about knowledge for the sake of knowledge. Like any expensive purchase, its important to know what you're buying before you buy, but that doesnt make it worthless

paulpauper 5y ago

Not true. The college wage premium even for the liberal arts is wide enough to make college worthwhile even after accounting for student loan debt. The trades req. certification and training which can be expensive and time consuming. A degree does not require as much maintence as certification.

lotsofpulp 5y ago
It is possible that was true over previous decades, and has changed recently, but is not yet reflected in the data.
- paulpauper 5y ago
  There is little reason or evidence to suggest it has changed.

devwastaken 5y ago

Yep, universities are cash cows funded with taxes, no incentives to compete, and artificially filled with bogus classes to up tuition costs. Sadly if you don't live in a major tech city, you either join the uni cult or get treated as an outsider. Cancel student loans.

lotsofpulp 5y ago
> Cancel student loans. Cancel all government subsidies via taxpayer guaranteed loans. All they do is distort the market and enrich the vendors.
paulpauper 5y ago
The problem is jobs reqiring degrees even if the work does not require it. Maybe this means higher quality of employees but at the same time leads to more demand for college and more debt.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  That is a symptom of the problem of excess supply of labor in relation to demand. The solution would require adjusting the supply of labor and/or demand for that type of labor.
- devwastaken 5y ago
  They won't if people can't get them. Make unis go bankrupt and close, replace with education that works and matters.

bawolff 5y ago

If someone is self-taught, i think its more likely than average they care about knowledge for the sake of knowledge. Like any expensive purchase, its important to know what you're buying before you buy, but that doesnt make it worthless