4 ms·

>BC's health officer, who everyone has listened to during this pandemic, has begged the Federal government (the Province and City of Vancouver also begging) to

by jdhn 5y ago

>BC's health officer, who everyone has listened to during this pandemic, has begged the Federal government (the Province and City of Vancouver also begging) to decriminalize drugs to help with this issue, but the Feds have done nothing. Alright, I'm going to poke the bear. How would decriminalization help? I'm assuming that by decriminialization, you mean legalizing the consumption, but not sale of drugs. If so, that doesn't solve the problem of the production of drugs, which IMO won't result in the changes that you want to see (drug users dying).

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
lemmox 5y ago
My wife actually asked this of some professionals working in this space yesterday at a local awareness event (she works in community services, unrelated to drug policy). The answer (paraphrased) was it doesn't directly stop the poisonings. It's in the spirit of harm reduction to open up more support channels. One example given was about going to the hospital and honesty with health professionals. Currently there's disincentives for an addict to disclose their addiction due to legal actions that get triggered upon disclosure. Removing those legal triggers could (would?) allow for more supervision without legal consequence to hopefully reduce the overall harm. It gave us something to chat about.
- jdhn 5y ago
  I'm curious, what rules exist? Are they at a federal or state level?
  - lemmox 5y ago
    One example provided, which I've not fact-checked and might be limited to BC, was that disclosing addiction during a hospital visit opens up a file with child welfare services.
  - II2II 5y ago
    I don't know if the federal government plays a role here, but the duty to report type laws for professionals are typically at a provincial level. That being said, as far as I know, they are fairly consistent across provinces.
jdudum 5y ago
I concur with this view. Perhaps a more effective solution to prevent drug users from dying due to drugs is for drug users to stop using drugs?
arcticbull 5y ago
Portugal decriminalized all drugs in 2001 and saw a massive drop in all the secondary issues associated with drug use - overdose deaths, disease, etc. In fact they went from among the worst in the EU to among the best over a decade or so, and saw no material increase in drug use. In fact drug use in Portugal remains below the EU average. [1,2] It’s long past time for us to follow suit. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radical-drugs-policy-is-working-why-hasnt-the-world-copied-it https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radic... [2] https://time.com/longform/portugal-drug-use-decriminalization/ https://time.com/longform/portugal-drug-use-decriminalizatio...
- alamortsubite 5y ago
  See also Switzerland.
- angelzen 5y ago
  Portugal situation is a bit more nuanced than 'decriminalized all drugs' implies. Drugs are still very much illegal and cannot be owned or traded. Not even marijuana. What changed is that possession of small quantities of drugs no longer leads to prison, but may lead to administrative penalties. > In July 2001, a new law maintained the status of illegality for using or possessing any drug for personal use without authorization. The offense was changed from a criminal one, with prison as a possible punishment, to an administrative one if the amount possessed was no more than a ten-day supply of that substance.[2] This was in line with the de facto Portuguese drug policy before the reform. Drug addicts were then to be aggressively targeted with therapy or community service rather than fines or waivers.[9] Even if there are no criminal penalties, these changes did not legalize drug use in Portugal. Possession has remained prohibited by Portuguese law, and criminal penalties are still applied to drug growers, dealers and traffickers.[10][11] Despite this, the law was still associated with a nearly 50% decrease in convictions and imprisonments of drug traffickers from 2001 to 2015.[12] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_Portugal#Regulation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_Portugal#Regula...
  - ogma 5y ago
    That's what is typically meant by "decriminalization". Unfortunately decriminalization is only a bad half-solution and all of those who profit off of both sides of the drug war will continue to exist, as will the inconsistent, contaminated, or mislabeled doses that are most fatal. It is absolutely imperative that we legalize nearly all recreational drugs along with regulatory measures to ensure that these medications are available OTC as standardized individually-packaged doses. The minimization of harm from drug abuse does also depend on broader societal factors (e.g. wealth inequality), and the transition will be complex, but there are measures to be taken that could drastically cut down on overdoses deaths in no more than a few weeks.
sandworm101 5y ago
It depends on which version of "decriminalization" one subscribes to. If it means not locking people up for possession then that can keep people out of the prison cycle. It means people will be less afraid to ask for help with their addictions. But if decriminalization means all drugs can be openly bought and sold, THAT won't help. Marijuana is one thing, but allowing carfentanil or rohypnol to be easily acquired by all would end very badly.
atatatat 5y ago
The idiots mixing in the Fent might actually use a scale if simply having one isn't another charge upgrade etc
Tiktaalik 5y ago
Illegality of drugs results in riskier behaviours (ie. hiding that you're using, using alone) that result in higher chances of overdose. Decriminalization is thought to yield safer use of drugs that will reduce deaths. There is also a broader issue of stigma. If the illegal stigma around drug use goes away, and addictions are treated more like a medical issue, it is thought that it will be more normalized for drug users to get help instead of shying away. On the opposite side there is also a stigma around medical professionals helping "addicts" that are breaking the law and many doctors are reluctant to touch these sort of health issues with a 10 foot pole. Decriminalization could help do away with this problem and pave the way to prescription of a safe supply of drugs. Drug users having a prescribed safe supply of drugs is the ultimate solution to the core problem here of a utterly toxic drug supply.

by jdhn 5y ago

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

lemmox 5y ago

My wife actually asked this of some professionals working in this space yesterday at a local awareness event (she works in community services, unrelated to drug policy). The answer (paraphrased) was it doesn't directly stop the poisonings. It's in the spirit of harm reduction to open up more support channels. One example given was about going to the hospital and honesty with health professionals. Currently there's disincentives for an addict to disclose their addiction due to legal actions that get triggered upon disclosure. Removing those legal triggers could (would?) allow for more supervision without legal consequence to hopefully reduce the overall harm. It gave us something to chat about.

jdhn 5y ago
I'm curious, what rules exist? Are they at a federal or state level?
- lemmox 5y ago
  One example provided, which I've not fact-checked and might be limited to BC, was that disclosing addiction during a hospital visit opens up a file with child welfare services.
- II2II 5y ago
  I don't know if the federal government plays a role here, but the duty to report type laws for professionals are typically at a provincial level. That being said, as far as I know, they are fairly consistent across provinces.

jdudum 5y ago

I concur with this view. Perhaps a more effective solution to prevent drug users from dying due to drugs is for drug users to stop using drugs?

arcticbull 5y ago

Portugal decriminalized all drugs in 2001 and saw a massive drop in all the secondary issues associated with drug use - overdose deaths, disease, etc. In fact they went from among the worst in the EU to among the best over a decade or so, and saw no material increase in drug use. In fact drug use in Portugal remains below the EU average. [1,2] It’s long past time for us to follow suit. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radical-drugs-policy-is-working-why-hasnt-the-world-copied-it https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radic... [2] https://time.com/longform/portugal-drug-use-decriminalization/ https://time.com/longform/portugal-drug-use-decriminalizatio...

alamortsubite 5y ago
See also Switzerland.
angelzen 5y ago
Portugal situation is a bit more nuanced than 'decriminalized all drugs' implies. Drugs are still very much illegal and cannot be owned or traded. Not even marijuana. What changed is that possession of small quantities of drugs no longer leads to prison, but may lead to administrative penalties. > In July 2001, a new law maintained the status of illegality for using or possessing any drug for personal use without authorization. The offense was changed from a criminal one, with prison as a possible punishment, to an administrative one if the amount possessed was no more than a ten-day supply of that substance.[2] This was in line with the de facto Portuguese drug policy before the reform. Drug addicts were then to be aggressively targeted with therapy or community service rather than fines or waivers.[9] Even if there are no criminal penalties, these changes did not legalize drug use in Portugal. Possession has remained prohibited by Portuguese law, and criminal penalties are still applied to drug growers, dealers and traffickers.[10][11] Despite this, the law was still associated with a nearly 50% decrease in convictions and imprisonments of drug traffickers from 2001 to 2015.[12] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_Portugal#Regulation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_Portugal#Regula...
- ogma 5y ago
  That's what is typically meant by "decriminalization". Unfortunately decriminalization is only a bad half-solution and all of those who profit off of both sides of the drug war will continue to exist, as will the inconsistent, contaminated, or mislabeled doses that are most fatal. It is absolutely imperative that we legalize nearly all recreational drugs along with regulatory measures to ensure that these medications are available OTC as standardized individually-packaged doses. The minimization of harm from drug abuse does also depend on broader societal factors (e.g. wealth inequality), and the transition will be complex, but there are measures to be taken that could drastically cut down on overdoses deaths in no more than a few weeks.

sandworm101 5y ago

It depends on which version of "decriminalization" one subscribes to. If it means not locking people up for possession then that can keep people out of the prison cycle. It means people will be less afraid to ask for help with their addictions. But if decriminalization means all drugs can be openly bought and sold, THAT won't help. Marijuana is one thing, but allowing carfentanil or rohypnol to be easily acquired by all would end very badly.

atatatat 5y ago

The idiots mixing in the Fent might actually use a scale if simply having one isn't another charge upgrade etc

Tiktaalik 5y ago

Illegality of drugs results in riskier behaviours (ie. hiding that you're using, using alone) that result in higher chances of overdose. Decriminalization is thought to yield safer use of drugs that will reduce deaths. There is also a broader issue of stigma. If the illegal stigma around drug use goes away, and addictions are treated more like a medical issue, it is thought that it will be more normalized for drug users to get help instead of shying away. On the opposite side there is also a stigma around medical professionals helping "addicts" that are breaking the law and many doctors are reluctant to touch these sort of health issues with a 10 foot pole. Decriminalization could help do away with this problem and pave the way to prescription of a safe supply of drugs. Drug users having a prescribed safe supply of drugs is the ultimate solution to the core problem here of a utterly toxic drug supply.