4 ms·

Still less creepy than the pledge of allegiance

by __m 5y ago

codezero 5y ago
How do you make a scale of comparison between the two?
- robert_foss 5y ago
  One has at leadt theoretical space for the transfer of knowledge. The other is pure propaganda.
  - codezero 5y ago
    Interesting take, I don't want to assume which you mean, but it seems like the pledge is pure propaganda, that said I find it more troubling when knowledge is intermixed with propaganda. At least pure propaganda is not trying to convince you it is anything else, like a space to transfer knowledge :)
- jsrcout 5y ago
  One includes the Dear Leader's name, one does not.
  - codezero 5y ago
    What are the units of that scale?
newbamboo 5y ago
Great point!
whoaisme 5y ago
People who compare US oddities with Chinese authoritarianism are such useful idiots. Let's see what happens with a kid when he refuses to study xi Jinping thought. This insipid anti americanism that infests the internet is the dead horse that keeps on kicking
tluyben2 5y ago
Someone was downvoted to hell for a comment, but it did make me think; can I refuse, as a kid in the US, to do the pledge? I cannot imagine having something like that where I was born; I think everyone + parents would've knocked it out of existence pretty much immediately, but can you, in the US, refuse to do it?
- trangus_1985 5y ago
  Yes. The child may face penalties and disciplinary action, but if the school does that, the parents can sue and will win. It's happened many times now. It's a church/state and compelled speech issue. The ACLU loves picking up these kinds of cases because it's such a softball. IANAL
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  At least when I was a kid and the whole "pledge" thing started happening, yeah you could skip it and no one did anything. However, I attended highschool in a very liberal town and the principal only ever played the anthem instead of the pledge anyway.
- pxc 5y ago
  you can, but a lot of teachers and other adults in charge of watching and disciplining children are not aware that you can. So for a kid to successfully refuse, they or their parents need to be well-informed of their rights and willing to threaten the school with legal action
- southeastern 5y ago
  I never did. Altho I was a Muslim kid growing up post 9/11 so I think that played into it

Still less creepy than the pledge of allegiance

by __m 5y ago

Still less creepy than the pledge of allegiance

codezero 5y ago

How do you make a scale of comparison between the two?

robert_foss 5y ago
One has at leadt theoretical space for the transfer of knowledge. The other is pure propaganda.
- codezero 5y ago
  Interesting take, I don't want to assume which you mean, but it seems like the pledge is pure propaganda, that said I find it more troubling when knowledge is intermixed with propaganda. At least pure propaganda is not trying to convince you it is anything else, like a space to transfer knowledge :)
jsrcout 5y ago
One includes the Dear Leader's name, one does not.
- codezero 5y ago
  What are the units of that scale?

newbamboo 5y ago

Great point!

whoaisme 5y ago

People who compare US oddities with Chinese authoritarianism are such useful idiots. Let's see what happens with a kid when he refuses to study xi Jinping thought. This insipid anti americanism that infests the internet is the dead horse that keeps on kicking

tluyben2 5y ago

Someone was downvoted to hell for a comment, but it did make me think; can I refuse, as a kid in the US, to do the pledge? I cannot imagine having something like that where I was born; I think everyone + parents would've knocked it out of existence pretty much immediately, but can you, in the US, refuse to do it?

trangus_1985 5y ago
Yes. The child may face penalties and disciplinary action, but if the school does that, the parents can sue and will win. It's happened many times now. It's a church/state and compelled speech issue. The ACLU loves picking up these kinds of cases because it's such a softball. IANAL
AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
At least when I was a kid and the whole "pledge" thing started happening, yeah you could skip it and no one did anything. However, I attended highschool in a very liberal town and the principal only ever played the anthem instead of the pledge anyway.
pxc 5y ago
you can, but a lot of teachers and other adults in charge of watching and disciplining children are not aware that you can. So for a kid to successfully refuse, they or their parents need to be well-informed of their rights and willing to threaten the school with legal action
southeastern 5y ago
I never did. Altho I was a Muslim kid growing up post 9/11 so I think that played into it