4 ms·

Honestly this position is pretty backwards. Forums shouldn’t be policing content unless it’s illegal. Why is everyone so desperate for regulated discussion?

by rank0 5y ago

snet0 5y ago
> Forums shouldn't be policing content Why not?
- COGlory 5y ago
  I'm not sure I agree with the parent that they shouldn't be policing content, but it's undeniable that doing so exacerbates echo chambers.
  - toofy 5y ago
    I can list *many* cases where echo chambers are not a bad thing at all. Of course this will depend on your definition of echo chamber, however, if any community doesn’t begin with “we hold certain things to be self-evident” then that community will be overrun with noise and off topic nonsense. It will be impossible to find any relevant signal. And anyone who doubts this only needs to look at completely hands off forums to see this. They may be fun occasionally, but these are hardly useful if you’re looking for some kind of information. Im not implying you’re doing this, but many people imply that anything other than “hands off” is an echo chamber, and honestly, this is just silly. that kind of definition of “echo chamber” is all but useless. echo chambers are hardly inherently bad.
  - rualca 5y ago
    > (...) but it's undeniable that doing so exacerbates echo chambers. No, not really. In fact, you got it exactly backwards. The problem was only made possible by these echo chambers. These conspiracy nuts create their subreddits and ban anyone who expresses any dissenting or even inconvenient information. Once these conspiracy nuts remove all reactionaries from the picture, they double down on craziness and create an environment in which everyone feeds off myths and fables repeated ad nauseum as self evident in spite of any lack of substance of bearing in reality. If these conspiracy loons weren't able to censor contrasting opinions and those calling them out on their bullshit, half these crazy rumours would not even go beyond the discussion.
krapp 5y ago
>Why is everyone so desperate for regulated discussion? No one is desperate, but not everyone wants to be confronted with conspiracy theory nonsense and racist shitposting everywhere they go on the internet just because some people believe "freedom of speech" means every site on the internet has to be run like 4chan. Every forum since the beginning of time has been policing content for reasons other then strict legality. You're on a forum that polices tone and quality, relentlessly downvotes and flags anything for any reason, considers all politics and mainstream content categorically off topic (even though, strictly speaking, it isn't) and treats humor like the plague. Laissez-faire hands-off general discussion forums have their place, just not everywhere. That's not fascism, or tyranny, or Orwellian dystopia, it's simply the result of the fact that servers and websites are private property, oftentimes services granted to users under certain and specific terms. Like it or not, all discussion on the internet has always been regulated to some degree.
- jlawson 5y ago
  If it's about 'not being confronted' with something you personally don't like, this can be handled at the subreddit level. Different subreddits can make their own censorship policies and you can join the one that censors the things you don't want to see. But we are talking about censorship on the sitewide level at Reddit, which affects all communities, even ones you have no interest in. This isn't about protecting yourself from content you'd dislike, it is, as always, about preventing others from talking amongst themselves in ways you dislike, even when you're not around.
  - krapp 5y ago
    We're talking about collective action by the users of multiple subreddits[0] demanding Reddit do something on a sitewide scale because they find this content is harming society as a whole. Let's not pretend this is a top-down issue, this is something part of the community seems to want. And nevertheless, subreddits aren't separate platforms. It's all still one big platform owned by one company. Subreddits are more like separate aisles in a supermarket - you can find frozen food in one aisle and bread in another, but the management still decides what does and doesn't go on the shelves. [0]https://old.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/pbe8nj/we_call_upon_reddit_to_take_action_against_the/ https://old.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/pbe8nj/we_cal...
belltaco 5y ago
>Forums shouldn’t be policing content unless it’s illegal. Why is everyone so desperate for regulated discussion? So I guess you're advocating for /r/jailbait to be brought back?

Honestly this position is pretty backwards. Forums shouldn’t be policing content unless it’s illegal. Why is everyone so desperate for regulated discussion?

by rank0 5y ago

Honestly this position is pretty backwards. Forums shouldn’t be policing content unless it’s illegal. Why is everyone so desperate for regulated discussion?

snet0 5y ago

> Forums shouldn't be policing content Why not?

COGlory 5y ago
I'm not sure I agree with the parent that they shouldn't be policing content, but it's undeniable that doing so exacerbates echo chambers.
- toofy 5y ago
  I can list *many* cases where echo chambers are not a bad thing at all. Of course this will depend on your definition of echo chamber, however, if any community doesn’t begin with “we hold certain things to be self-evident” then that community will be overrun with noise and off topic nonsense. It will be impossible to find any relevant signal. And anyone who doubts this only needs to look at completely hands off forums to see this. They may be fun occasionally, but these are hardly useful if you’re looking for some kind of information. Im not implying you’re doing this, but many people imply that anything other than “hands off” is an echo chamber, and honestly, this is just silly. that kind of definition of “echo chamber” is all but useless. echo chambers are hardly inherently bad.
- rualca 5y ago
  > (...) but it's undeniable that doing so exacerbates echo chambers. No, not really. In fact, you got it exactly backwards. The problem was only made possible by these echo chambers. These conspiracy nuts create their subreddits and ban anyone who expresses any dissenting or even inconvenient information. Once these conspiracy nuts remove all reactionaries from the picture, they double down on craziness and create an environment in which everyone feeds off myths and fables repeated ad nauseum as self evident in spite of any lack of substance of bearing in reality. If these conspiracy loons weren't able to censor contrasting opinions and those calling them out on their bullshit, half these crazy rumours would not even go beyond the discussion.

krapp 5y ago

>Why is everyone so desperate for regulated discussion? No one is desperate, but not everyone wants to be confronted with conspiracy theory nonsense and racist shitposting everywhere they go on the internet just because some people believe "freedom of speech" means every site on the internet has to be run like 4chan. Every forum since the beginning of time has been policing content for reasons other then strict legality. You're on a forum that polices tone and quality, relentlessly downvotes and flags anything for any reason, considers all politics and mainstream content categorically off topic (even though, strictly speaking, it isn't) and treats humor like the plague. Laissez-faire hands-off general discussion forums have their place, just not everywhere. That's not fascism, or tyranny, or Orwellian dystopia, it's simply the result of the fact that servers and websites are private property, oftentimes services granted to users under certain and specific terms. Like it or not, all discussion on the internet has always been regulated to some degree.

jlawson 5y ago
If it's about 'not being confronted' with something you personally don't like, this can be handled at the subreddit level. Different subreddits can make their own censorship policies and you can join the one that censors the things you don't want to see. But we are talking about censorship on the sitewide level at Reddit, which affects all communities, even ones you have no interest in. This isn't about protecting yourself from content you'd dislike, it is, as always, about preventing others from talking amongst themselves in ways you dislike, even when you're not around.
- krapp 5y ago
  We're talking about collective action by the users of multiple subreddits[0] demanding Reddit do something on a sitewide scale because they find this content is harming society as a whole. Let's not pretend this is a top-down issue, this is something part of the community seems to want. And nevertheless, subreddits aren't separate platforms. It's all still one big platform owned by one company. Subreddits are more like separate aisles in a supermarket - you can find frozen food in one aisle and bread in another, but the management still decides what does and doesn't go on the shelves. [0]https://old.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/pbe8nj/we_call_upon_reddit_to_take_action_against_the/ https://old.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/pbe8nj/we_cal...

belltaco 5y ago

>Forums shouldn’t be policing content unless it’s illegal. Why is everyone so desperate for regulated discussion? So I guess you're advocating for /r/jailbait to be brought back?