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The very thread and subreddit where this started is concerning in the opposite way, if you ask me. Where do you draw the line? What is misinformation and what i

The very thread and subreddit where this started is concerning in the opposite way, if you ask me. Where do you draw the line? What is misinformation and what isn't? Who decides? I read some comments in that very thread and just saying that you had a week of side effects but are glad you got the shot is enough to get an antivax label. There is a line between wanting to stop the spread of blatant nonsense and bullying people who dare ask questions and pose reasonable doubts. Not allowing different viewpoints like this and flooding even the reasonable critics with insults and mocking is what concerns me the most

casefields 5y ago
It's toe the government line or else... As if 2003 and WMDs is ancient history. The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
- amanaplanacanal 5y ago
  I may be wrong, but it feels like the same party that was pushing the WMD theory is now pushing the antivax and no mask line.
  - mc32 5y ago
    As they say, it's "complicated". Antivaxxers by and large, used to be highly educated people (PhDs) and leaned dem. Now it's the opposite. The neo-cons who advanced the accusation of WMDs are now supporters of Biden. And, interestingly majorities in _both_ parties support the withdrawal from AF. So, it's not straightforward as you may wish.
    - rualca 5y ago
      Can you back any of your assertions with any reference? Other than everyone wanting the war in Afghanistan to end ASAP, every single one of your statements is.... Peculiar.
      - ender341341 5y ago
        Anti-vaxxers were predominantly educated liberals until a few years ago and it seems with Covid it's flipped pretty fast, but with multiple outbreaks of easily preventable diseases over the last few years a lot of that crowd started seeing the value in vaccines. His statement of neo-cons supporting Biden could definitely use some sources, at least if it's in any way that's not just "Never Trump"
        vimacs2 5y ago
        I don't see much connection there. Anti-vaxxers were (and in fact still are) predominantly wealthy white people but that's a function of having an excess of free time and lack of first hand experience with much death or infectious disease, not political leanings.
  - holdupnow 5y ago
    You're not wrong. Everyone is thinking it but nobody is saying it out of fear of becoming an outcast
  - vimacs2 5y ago
    You are in fact wrong. It was the CIA and the military-industrial complex invested in plundering Iraq that pushed the WMD theory and the resulting war was something with bipartisan support in the USA - liberals and conservatives alike. Not a fan of antivaxxers but I'm even less of a fan of liberals attempting to whitewash recent history to make themselves look more reasonable.
    - rualca 5y ago
      > You are in fact wrong. I recall seeing George W Bush and Colin Powell repeatedly pushing for military intervention using WMDs as the excuse. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp6WuTSTyS8 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp6WuTSTyS8
  - Dwelve 5y ago
    I'd say the side that says you're siding with the enemy if you disagree with them is the problem. "You're either with us or with the terrorists" "You're either for lockdowns or for the virus"
- lostlogin 5y ago
  > As if 2003 and WMDs is ancient history. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. There weren’t good intentions where 2003 and WMDs were concerned.
  - dredmorbius 5y ago
    Nor now with the antivax / antimask disinformation, propaganda, and hysteria.
Buttons840 5y ago
Or God forbid you ask for advice on how to help a family member address their concerns. "My dad is worried because <insert complicated issues and good questions>". People may have different educations, even inferior educations, but the basic rules of effective communication still apply. You can't just set up a straw man, mock the straw man, and then expect your message to be effective.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
rualca 5y ago
> Where do you draw the line? What is misinformation and what isn't? Who decides? The Reddit posts present clear examples of blatant misinformation, such as: * Claims that COVID-19 does not exist at all, * Wearing masks can suffocate you, * COVID-19 is just a flu, * COVID-19 is a bioweapon, * COVID-19 vaccines are not safe and are untested, * COVID-19 vaccines are a DNA experiment, * Etc. Unless you're gunning for a slippery slope argument, we don't need to dig too deep to find subreddits that are a constant stream of these claims, and even worse claims.
- Dwelve 5y ago
  This is absolutely hilarious. "Blatant misinformation" like "COVID-19 vaccines are not safe". I'd be upset but you're making the best case possible why this entire farce was such a joke
  - rualca 5y ago
    > This is absolutely hilarious. "Blatant misinformation" like "COVID-19 vaccines are not safe". (...) Instead of venting your frustration, can you provide any evidence supporting your belief that any of the major vaccines is not safe? Entire countries have already distributed at least the first dose to the vast majority of their population. If your belief had any merit or basis on reality, you have already a pool of hundreds of million of people who took the vaccine to gather evidence. And where is the evidence? I would dare say that the main risk associated with any of the major COVID-19 vaccines is presented by antivaxers who have been caught tampering with vaccination drives.
    - Dwelve 5y ago
      Before I do that, can you please tell me how you will react if I give you evidence that any of the major vaccines are not safe? Like I give you hard undeniable evidence, what will your reaction look like? Will you apologize to every single person that you "attacked for spreading misinformation"? Will you change your stance and from now on at least say "there are downsides to the vaccines"? Will you go back to your old comments and amend them saying "vaccines are actually not save"? Just be honest and precise what exactly changes if I give you evidence that the vacciens are not safe and which of the claims should be removed from social media for misinformation - "The vaccines are save" or "The vaccines are not safe" one of those is misinformation that can literally kill people, which one will you seek to be removed if I would be able to provide evidence that vaccines are not safe?

casefields 5y ago

It's toe the government line or else... As if 2003 and WMDs is ancient history. The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

amanaplanacanal 5y ago
I may be wrong, but it feels like the same party that was pushing the WMD theory is now pushing the antivax and no mask line.
- mc32 5y ago
  As they say, it's "complicated". Antivaxxers by and large, used to be highly educated people (PhDs) and leaned dem. Now it's the opposite. The neo-cons who advanced the accusation of WMDs are now supporters of Biden. And, interestingly majorities in _both_ parties support the withdrawal from AF. So, it's not straightforward as you may wish.
  - rualca 5y ago
    Can you back any of your assertions with any reference? Other than everyone wanting the war in Afghanistan to end ASAP, every single one of your statements is.... Peculiar.
    - ender341341 5y ago
      Anti-vaxxers were predominantly educated liberals until a few years ago and it seems with Covid it's flipped pretty fast, but with multiple outbreaks of easily preventable diseases over the last few years a lot of that crowd started seeing the value in vaccines. His statement of neo-cons supporting Biden could definitely use some sources, at least if it's in any way that's not just "Never Trump"
      - vimacs2 5y ago
        I don't see much connection there. Anti-vaxxers were (and in fact still are) predominantly wealthy white people but that's a function of having an excess of free time and lack of first hand experience with much death or infectious disease, not political leanings.
- holdupnow 5y ago
  You're not wrong. Everyone is thinking it but nobody is saying it out of fear of becoming an outcast
- vimacs2 5y ago
  You are in fact wrong. It was the CIA and the military-industrial complex invested in plundering Iraq that pushed the WMD theory and the resulting war was something with bipartisan support in the USA - liberals and conservatives alike. Not a fan of antivaxxers but I'm even less of a fan of liberals attempting to whitewash recent history to make themselves look more reasonable.
  - rualca 5y ago
    > You are in fact wrong. I recall seeing George W Bush and Colin Powell repeatedly pushing for military intervention using WMDs as the excuse. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp6WuTSTyS8 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp6WuTSTyS8
- Dwelve 5y ago
  I'd say the side that says you're siding with the enemy if you disagree with them is the problem. "You're either with us or with the terrorists" "You're either for lockdowns or for the virus"
lostlogin 5y ago
> As if 2003 and WMDs is ancient history. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. There weren’t good intentions where 2003 and WMDs were concerned.
- dredmorbius 5y ago
  Nor now with the antivax / antimask disinformation, propaganda, and hysteria.

Buttons840 5y ago

Or God forbid you ask for advice on how to help a family member address their concerns. "My dad is worried because <insert complicated issues and good questions>". People may have different educations, even inferior educations, but the basic rules of effective communication still apply. You can't just set up a straw man, mock the straw man, and then expect your message to be effective.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

rualca 5y ago

> Where do you draw the line? What is misinformation and what isn't? Who decides? The Reddit posts present clear examples of blatant misinformation, such as: * Claims that COVID-19 does not exist at all, * Wearing masks can suffocate you, * COVID-19 is just a flu, * COVID-19 is a bioweapon, * COVID-19 vaccines are not safe and are untested, * COVID-19 vaccines are a DNA experiment, * Etc. Unless you're gunning for a slippery slope argument, we don't need to dig too deep to find subreddits that are a constant stream of these claims, and even worse claims.

Dwelve 5y ago
This is absolutely hilarious. "Blatant misinformation" like "COVID-19 vaccines are not safe". I'd be upset but you're making the best case possible why this entire farce was such a joke
- rualca 5y ago
  > This is absolutely hilarious. "Blatant misinformation" like "COVID-19 vaccines are not safe". (...) Instead of venting your frustration, can you provide any evidence supporting your belief that any of the major vaccines is not safe? Entire countries have already distributed at least the first dose to the vast majority of their population. If your belief had any merit or basis on reality, you have already a pool of hundreds of million of people who took the vaccine to gather evidence. And where is the evidence? I would dare say that the main risk associated with any of the major COVID-19 vaccines is presented by antivaxers who have been caught tampering with vaccination drives.
  - Dwelve 5y ago
    Before I do that, can you please tell me how you will react if I give you evidence that any of the major vaccines are not safe? Like I give you hard undeniable evidence, what will your reaction look like? Will you apologize to every single person that you "attacked for spreading misinformation"? Will you change your stance and from now on at least say "there are downsides to the vaccines"? Will you go back to your old comments and amend them saying "vaccines are actually not save"? Just be honest and precise what exactly changes if I give you evidence that the vacciens are not safe and which of the claims should be removed from social media for misinformation - "The vaccines are save" or "The vaccines are not safe" one of those is misinformation that can literally kill people, which one will you seek to be removed if I would be able to provide evidence that vaccines are not safe?