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> Neither of the defendants’ families are disputing the basic claim that their kids stole from Mr. Schober. Rather, they’re claiming that time has run out on Sc

> Neither of the defendants’ families are disputing the basic claim that their kids stole from Mr. Schober. Rather, they’re claiming that time has run out on Schober’s legal ability to claim a cause of action against them. I was honestly shocked to read this. Can it be surprising the kids think it's okay to steal if this is their parent's response? Clearly two very smart guys but in the long run ethics matter a lot more than money or intelligence.

KingMachiavelli 5y ago
16 bitcoin is worth $784,000 which is probably enough to delegate morality to the legal system.
- krebsonsecurity 5y ago
  Yep. And it was worth close to a million on the day he filed this lawsuit.
malshe 5y ago
My thoughts exactly!
mikestew 5y ago
Meh, gotta learn it somewhere. Some kid in the neighborhood broke into a bunch of mailboxes. Looked him up, looked up his dad. It came as no surprise that the kid's father is no longer allowed to make telephone sales in the state of Tennessee. I'll leave it to the reader's imagination as to why that might be.
mikeryan 5y ago
There’s no admission of guilt here. They’re just starting with this as an initial argument as the rest becomes moot if the motion succeeds.
- TacticalCoder 5y ago
  That is not the point. There's the legal system. Then there's morality and how you raise kids. If the parents act like these, they shouldn't be surprised they're raising little filthy thieves. In other words: parents raising kids giving them values like respecting the private property of others (no matter if it's actual physical gold coins, a bicycle, Bitcoins or whatever really) probably wouldn't use such pathetic tactics to try to dismiss the case. But the real point is: parents raising kids with actual values probably wouldn't be raising scummy thieves in the first place.
  - baryphonic 5y ago
    The parents were wrong to ignore the victim's letters. That's a lot of money to force your kids give back, and I know it would be tempting to keep it if my kids did a similar thing, but the morally courageous thing would have been to return it then and there. It seems they took the greedy path. However, aggressively defending one's legal rights is also morally justified, esp. in Common Law jurisdictions with adversarial procedure. In fact, we'd likely have a more just (and thus more moral) system if more people asserted their legal rights in criminal trials, and took matters before juries rather than prisoner's dilemma plea agreements. (I understand why they don't, which is why plea agreements are so pernicious.)
    - paxys 5y ago
      Would there even be a way to verify the victim's claims? If I got a random letter in the mail saying my kid stole $XX and I should pay it back voluntarily to not get the courts involved, I'd just toss it in the trash.
cheeze 5y ago
There is, IMO, a difference between legal punishment and parental punishment. More likely than not, the bitcoin is gone and the parents don't want to be on the hook for a substantial sum of money. Meanwhile, their kid is grounded for ever.
paxys 5y ago
People can talk about ethics at length when they themselves are not involved, but when faced with this exact situation I can guarantee that everyone here would also try and get the case dismissed rather than be on the hook for a million dollars.
- celticninja 5y ago
  Especially as their kid probably spent it when it was worth a lot less, so they really have no way to repay that sum. Although it is a fair sum to sue for. If he had found their details when BTC was $1000 it would have been easier on everyone. Their kid was too good but not good enough at hiding his tracks. I wonder if HMRC would be interested in what would have been a considerable capital gain which likely went unreported for tax purposes.

KingMachiavelli 5y ago

16 bitcoin is worth $784,000 which is probably enough to delegate morality to the legal system.

krebsonsecurity 5y ago
Yep. And it was worth close to a million on the day he filed this lawsuit.

malshe 5y ago

My thoughts exactly!

mikestew 5y ago

Meh, gotta learn it somewhere. Some kid in the neighborhood broke into a bunch of mailboxes. Looked him up, looked up his dad. It came as no surprise that the kid's father is no longer allowed to make telephone sales in the state of Tennessee. I'll leave it to the reader's imagination as to why that might be.

mikeryan 5y ago

There’s no admission of guilt here. They’re just starting with this as an initial argument as the rest becomes moot if the motion succeeds.

TacticalCoder 5y ago
That is not the point. There's the legal system. Then there's morality and how you raise kids. If the parents act like these, they shouldn't be surprised they're raising little filthy thieves. In other words: parents raising kids giving them values like respecting the private property of others (no matter if it's actual physical gold coins, a bicycle, Bitcoins or whatever really) probably wouldn't use such pathetic tactics to try to dismiss the case. But the real point is: parents raising kids with actual values probably wouldn't be raising scummy thieves in the first place.
- baryphonic 5y ago
  The parents were wrong to ignore the victim's letters. That's a lot of money to force your kids give back, and I know it would be tempting to keep it if my kids did a similar thing, but the morally courageous thing would have been to return it then and there. It seems they took the greedy path. However, aggressively defending one's legal rights is also morally justified, esp. in Common Law jurisdictions with adversarial procedure. In fact, we'd likely have a more just (and thus more moral) system if more people asserted their legal rights in criminal trials, and took matters before juries rather than prisoner's dilemma plea agreements. (I understand why they don't, which is why plea agreements are so pernicious.)
  - paxys 5y ago
    Would there even be a way to verify the victim's claims? If I got a random letter in the mail saying my kid stole $XX and I should pay it back voluntarily to not get the courts involved, I'd just toss it in the trash.

cheeze 5y ago

There is, IMO, a difference between legal punishment and parental punishment. More likely than not, the bitcoin is gone and the parents don't want to be on the hook for a substantial sum of money. Meanwhile, their kid is grounded for ever.

paxys 5y ago

People can talk about ethics at length when they themselves are not involved, but when faced with this exact situation I can guarantee that everyone here would also try and get the case dismissed rather than be on the hook for a million dollars.

celticninja 5y ago
Especially as their kid probably spent it when it was worth a lot less, so they really have no way to repay that sum. Although it is a fair sum to sue for. If he had found their details when BTC was $1000 it would have been easier on everyone. Their kid was too good but not good enough at hiding his tracks. I wonder if HMRC would be interested in what would have been a considerable capital gain which likely went unreported for tax purposes.