4 ms·

This only works until every "smart" device has a cellular modem built in.

by BeefySwain 5y ago

netr0ute 5y ago
Who pays for the cellular plans?
- koolba 5y ago
  Amazon put a cellular chip in a Kindle over a decade ago. And that was for a device that cost less than $100. One year of advertising and analytics would easily cover the cost in a larger purchase like a TV.
- prepend 5y ago
  We do as part of the device cost. 5G makes it pretty cheap so a manufacturer adding in a radio ups their cost by a dollar or two. The revenue from surveillance is marginally profitable including data costs.
Buttons840 5y ago
You can come up with other fun conspiracies by realizing that the HDMI spec can share internet connections. Plugging in your "fire cast", or whatever external television device you use, could provide your TV an internet connection, but it doesn't seem to be widely used yet.
- sgrove 5y ago
  This is, it seems, just untrue. It was posted before (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24668736 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24668736) and I was curious about this attack vector so looked it up [0] Simply put, it seems that this never took off and would require the entire hdmi chain to support it (tv, cable, and device) - none of which do currently, so for the medium future it doesn't seem to be a concern. Plenty of concern elsewhere, just not necessarily here. [0] https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/325215/appletv-ethernet-over-hdmi https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/325215/appletv-eth...
  - nitrogen 5y ago
    It's definitely real. A/V receivers are the typical devices to support HEC, so you can run one Ethernet cable to the receiver and use a smart TV with the HDMI audio return channel, with one HDMI cable.
    - sgrove 5y ago
      Interesting! You're suggesting that the A/V would bridge the ethernet connection over the HDMI cable audio signal?
      - nitrogen 5y ago
        That's the intent, and it's still in the latest HDMI spec, so I think those threads about HEC being dead were premature. I haven't used it myself.
    - detaro 5y ago
      > A/V receivers are the typical devices to support HEC Then you surely can name a few models that support Ethernet over HDMI? (Somehow people keep claiming that this is totally a thing, but nobody ever can confirm a single device)
      - nitrogen 5y ago
        Not one of these says anything about HEC being discontinued: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=hdmi+with+ethernet https://duckduckgo.com/?q=hdmi+with+ethernet Can you name a manufacturer of devices or chips that has committed to never implementing Ethernet over HDMI? The same wires are used for the audio return channel, so they have to be present in cables. The HDMI consortium website still refers to cables as "HDMI with Ethernet".
        detaro 5y ago
        If you claim that receivers are "the typical devices" to implement something, you should really be able to at least show one or two models that support it. No, it's never been formally declared dead, but it de-facto is by virtue of not existing in practice.

This only works until every "smart" device has a cellular modem built in.

netr0ute 5y ago

Who pays for the cellular plans?

koolba 5y ago
Amazon put a cellular chip in a Kindle over a decade ago. And that was for a device that cost less than $100. One year of advertising and analytics would easily cover the cost in a larger purchase like a TV.
prepend 5y ago
We do as part of the device cost. 5G makes it pretty cheap so a manufacturer adding in a radio ups their cost by a dollar or two. The revenue from surveillance is marginally profitable including data costs.

Buttons840 5y ago

You can come up with other fun conspiracies by realizing that the HDMI spec can share internet connections. Plugging in your "fire cast", or whatever external television device you use, could provide your TV an internet connection, but it doesn't seem to be widely used yet.

sgrove 5y ago
This is, it seems, just untrue. It was posted before (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24668736 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24668736) and I was curious about this attack vector so looked it up [0] Simply put, it seems that this never took off and would require the entire hdmi chain to support it (tv, cable, and device) - none of which do currently, so for the medium future it doesn't seem to be a concern. Plenty of concern elsewhere, just not necessarily here. [0] https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/325215/appletv-ethernet-over-hdmi https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/325215/appletv-eth...
- nitrogen 5y ago
  It's definitely real. A/V receivers are the typical devices to support HEC, so you can run one Ethernet cable to the receiver and use a smart TV with the HDMI audio return channel, with one HDMI cable.
  - sgrove 5y ago
    Interesting! You're suggesting that the A/V would bridge the ethernet connection over the HDMI cable audio signal?
    - nitrogen 5y ago
      That's the intent, and it's still in the latest HDMI spec, so I think those threads about HEC being dead were premature. I haven't used it myself.
  - detaro 5y ago
    > A/V receivers are the typical devices to support HEC Then you surely can name a few models that support Ethernet over HDMI? (Somehow people keep claiming that this is totally a thing, but nobody ever can confirm a single device)
    - nitrogen 5y ago
      Not one of these says anything about HEC being discontinued: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=hdmi+with+ethernet https://duckduckgo.com/?q=hdmi+with+ethernet Can you name a manufacturer of devices or chips that has committed to never implementing Ethernet over HDMI? The same wires are used for the audio return channel, so they have to be present in cables. The HDMI consortium website still refers to cables as "HDMI with Ethernet".
      - detaro 5y ago
        If you claim that receivers are "the typical devices" to implement something, you should really be able to at least show one or two models that support it. No, it's never been formally declared dead, but it de-facto is by virtue of not existing in practice.