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>> Banning sellers for no good reason, and you cant contact anyone helpful. I must be getting old. How did these companies get so massive without any meaningf

>> Banning sellers for no good reason, and you cant contact anyone helpful. I must be getting old. How did these companies get so massive without any meaningful customer service departments? Amazon, Google, Facebook and many, many others where customer service is not even bothered with, yet people continue to use their products and services.

theturtletalks 5y ago
It's because they make it super easy for the customer, but use dark patterns for the sellers. Amazon can afford to lose sellers since more are popping up everyday and willing to sell items for a loss to gain market share. The parent also didn't mention that Amazon has a policy of not allowing sellers to sell their products for a lower price on their own website. If only customers knew how much Amazon is screwing over sellers, they would be wary. Many sellers I know themselves don't shop on Amazon themselves due to this.
- bushbaba 5y ago
  As a customer why should I care about the seller experience. As a customer I’ve only ever cared about the customer buying experience
  - fossuser 5y ago
    Agreed - Amazon knows who their real customers are and they have leverage over the sellers. It does surprise me though that given that there's a lot of counterfeit junk and scam-like sellers on the site (which is a pretty bad customer experience). You'd think they'd shut that down. In practice it doesn't matter because prime shipping is so much better than any non-amazon option I just deal with that risk (with some exceptions where I'll buy directly from the creator of the product).
    - thaumasiotes 5y ago
      > In practice it doesn't matter because prime shipping is so much better than any non-amazon option I just deal with that risk Really? I'm strongly considering canceling my prime subscription specifically because shipping has gotten so awful. Amazon won't even allow you to select a shipping speed anymore. Pretty much everywhere else on the internet is better.
      - fossuser 5y ago
        My recent experience with non-amazon shipping: - Ordered a blanket directly from the blanket maker's website, order details were delayed, no shipping notice, no out of stock notice, order took 4 months to arrive (it was supposed to be a gift). - Ordered some flatware from MOMA was charged and no shipping details updated, I waited six weeks before emailing them - they said the system 'lost the order' I had to have paypal reverse the charges. There are other examples, but generally non-amazon sucks - even in the best of cases it's twice as long and usually expensive. With Amazon I often get two day, next day, or even same day shipping for free. Packages arrive typically well packaged and undamaged and the tracking is really good. If there are any issues they are quick to resolve it.
        thaumasiotes 5y ago
        > Packages arrive typically well packaged and undamaged That's another thing. Amazon used to ship things in boxes with appropriate padding. Now they're shipping books in manila envelopes, with predictable damage to the book from the tightness of the envelope.
        fossuser 5y ago
        I wonder if there's regional variation depending on warehouses? I'm in SF and have had pretty good experiences. It's mostly a comparison I'm making to alternatives which I've found to be worse (usually the non-amazon packaging is terrible).
        JohnFen 5y ago
        None of that is like my most recent interactions with Amazon.
    - JohnFen 5y ago
      > prime shipping is so much better than any non-amazon option This isn't as true as it used to be, and it's getting less true as time goes on.
- andromeduck 5y ago
  I'd buy from vendor sites if it weren't always such a pita between checkouts, shipping and refunds.
- JohnFen 5y ago
  > Amazon has a policy of not allowing sellers to sell their products for a lower price on their own website. This is why, when I decided to ditch Amazon, I also decided to avoid buying from companies that sell on Amazon.
pengaru 5y ago
Short-term convenience wins every time.
kelvin0 5y ago
The retail customers who end up buying the stuff are lavishly treated. The small businesses which sell their products on Amazon are not really 'customers' and are treated like 5th class citizens. Proof and burden rests on these suppliers shoulders.
blacktriangle 5y ago
You do sound like my parents. They were mainframe programmers in the 70s and still every time I complain about wierd issues I'm having with programming, they'll keep asking me if I've called tech support. They can't wrap their head around how you can have useful-ish software with shitty incomplete out of date documentation and tech support via people competing to get noticed on StackOverflow for their resume. The more time goes on, I'm not sure I can wrap my head around it either...
Johnny555 5y ago
How did these companies get so massive without any meaningful customer service departments? Amazon, Google, Facebook and many, many others where customer service is not even bothered with, yet people continue to use their products and services. As a customer, I've had no trouble reaching Amazon customer service when I need help, and they've always been helpful - refunding or replacing the defective product.
- JohnFen 5y ago
  As a customer, I only needed customer service from them once (in the over 10 years I've been buying from them). My experience was truly terrible, and I ended up losing my money.

theturtletalks 5y ago

It's because they make it super easy for the customer, but use dark patterns for the sellers. Amazon can afford to lose sellers since more are popping up everyday and willing to sell items for a loss to gain market share. The parent also didn't mention that Amazon has a policy of not allowing sellers to sell their products for a lower price on their own website. If only customers knew how much Amazon is screwing over sellers, they would be wary. Many sellers I know themselves don't shop on Amazon themselves due to this.

bushbaba 5y ago
As a customer why should I care about the seller experience. As a customer I’ve only ever cared about the customer buying experience
- fossuser 5y ago
  Agreed - Amazon knows who their real customers are and they have leverage over the sellers. It does surprise me though that given that there's a lot of counterfeit junk and scam-like sellers on the site (which is a pretty bad customer experience). You'd think they'd shut that down. In practice it doesn't matter because prime shipping is so much better than any non-amazon option I just deal with that risk (with some exceptions where I'll buy directly from the creator of the product).
  - thaumasiotes 5y ago
    > In practice it doesn't matter because prime shipping is so much better than any non-amazon option I just deal with that risk Really? I'm strongly considering canceling my prime subscription specifically because shipping has gotten so awful. Amazon won't even allow you to select a shipping speed anymore. Pretty much everywhere else on the internet is better.
    - fossuser 5y ago
      My recent experience with non-amazon shipping: - Ordered a blanket directly from the blanket maker's website, order details were delayed, no shipping notice, no out of stock notice, order took 4 months to arrive (it was supposed to be a gift). - Ordered some flatware from MOMA was charged and no shipping details updated, I waited six weeks before emailing them - they said the system 'lost the order' I had to have paypal reverse the charges. There are other examples, but generally non-amazon sucks - even in the best of cases it's twice as long and usually expensive. With Amazon I often get two day, next day, or even same day shipping for free. Packages arrive typically well packaged and undamaged and the tracking is really good. If there are any issues they are quick to resolve it.
      - thaumasiotes 5y ago
        > Packages arrive typically well packaged and undamaged That's another thing. Amazon used to ship things in boxes with appropriate padding. Now they're shipping books in manila envelopes, with predictable damage to the book from the tightness of the envelope.
        fossuser 5y ago
        I wonder if there's regional variation depending on warehouses? I'm in SF and have had pretty good experiences. It's mostly a comparison I'm making to alternatives which I've found to be worse (usually the non-amazon packaging is terrible).
      - JohnFen 5y ago
        None of that is like my most recent interactions with Amazon.
  - JohnFen 5y ago
    > prime shipping is so much better than any non-amazon option This isn't as true as it used to be, and it's getting less true as time goes on.
andromeduck 5y ago
I'd buy from vendor sites if it weren't always such a pita between checkouts, shipping and refunds.
JohnFen 5y ago
> Amazon has a policy of not allowing sellers to sell their products for a lower price on their own website. This is why, when I decided to ditch Amazon, I also decided to avoid buying from companies that sell on Amazon.

pengaru 5y ago

Short-term convenience wins every time.

kelvin0 5y ago

The retail customers who end up buying the stuff are lavishly treated. The small businesses which sell their products on Amazon are not really 'customers' and are treated like 5th class citizens. Proof and burden rests on these suppliers shoulders.

blacktriangle 5y ago

You do sound like my parents. They were mainframe programmers in the 70s and still every time I complain about wierd issues I'm having with programming, they'll keep asking me if I've called tech support. They can't wrap their head around how you can have useful-ish software with shitty incomplete out of date documentation and tech support via people competing to get noticed on StackOverflow for their resume. The more time goes on, I'm not sure I can wrap my head around it either...

Johnny555 5y ago

How did these companies get so massive without any meaningful customer service departments? Amazon, Google, Facebook and many, many others where customer service is not even bothered with, yet people continue to use their products and services. As a customer, I've had no trouble reaching Amazon customer service when I need help, and they've always been helpful - refunding or replacing the defective product.

JohnFen 5y ago
As a customer, I only needed customer service from them once (in the over 10 years I've been buying from them). My experience was truly terrible, and I ended up losing my money.