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I honestly believe that's not Apple's place. Apple is a technology company, not a non-profit founded to help find missing or abused children. NCMEC has a prett
by knaik94 5y ago
I honestly believe that's not Apple's place. Apple is a technology company, not a non-profit founded to help find missing or abused children.
NCMEC has a pretty good and non-controversial reputation and you really only heard about it if you were working in that kind of law enforcement field. Or you knew of the database if you were personally working on tech for filtering and managing submission of photo/video from the public, like facebook image uploads and had to manage submitting reports of found CSAM. I personally only knew of the amber alerts, which are national broadcast messages that show up on my phone informing of cases of serious abduction incidents.
I think for people informed about tech, the most unpopular thing about NCMEC is their stance on promoting a backdoor in all E2E encryption to ensure CSAM is flagged. [1] But even that, you understand where they're coming from even if you believe that backdoors are a bad idea. The NCMEC is a government funded non-profit for the explicit purpose of finding missing and exploited children.
It's just not Apple's place unless it will also have a department for the explicit purpose of finding missing and exploited children. And at that point it's a branch of NCMEC working in Apple.
Child protective services isn't NCMEC. And NCMEC isn't law enforcement, the organization works with law enforcement and doesn't directly go after anyone.
I have never heard of people that have gotten into serious trouble because of overeager employees. I wasn't able to find it via google either, I would love to get more information if you have a link.
I have heard of three letter government agencies allegedly planting CSAM on targets they want to get leverage on. But whether actual CSAM is planted or they lie in order to get probable cause to do searches and intimidate, I'm not sure.
This article from 2019 outlines an instance where law enforcement accused someone of handling CSAM based on filenames and an IP address, but weren't able to find the file after doing an actual search on the device. [2] They ended up dropping the case instead of letting the lawyers examine the method used tag alleged predators. They actually dropped cases instead of disclosing how the software worked multiple times for the sake of protecting how the software works, and arguably let alleged predators walk free.
But all of that is separate from NCMEC which just handles a cyber tipline and follows up on reports from tech companies about any potential CSAM and is in charge of handling the database of known positives in the US.
Apple has stated they will require the database to be cross-checked across different countries and jurisdictions in order to ensure no one can add false matches. So they don't want to identify CSAM for just the US, they want it to be a global program even if they are just rolling it out in the US.
1. https://www.missingkids.org/theissues/end-to-end-encryption https://www.missingkids.org/theissues/end-to-end-encryption
2. https://www.propublica.org/article/prosecutors-dropping-child-porn-charges-after-software-tools-are-questioned https://www.propublica.org/article/prosecutors-dropping-chil...
- pyuser583 5y agoThere has been some controversy of NCMEC. Specifically, they claim to a private organization, not subject to any of the constraints that public actors have (4th amendment). In a case decided by future SCOTUS justice Gorsuch, it was decided NCMEC is “public agent.” That is, an agent of the government. That’s because is possess immunity from prosecution for possession of CSAM. When an electronic communication is referred to NCMEC, after, say, being identified by a hash, a NCMEC analyst reviews it. NCMEC claimed this wasn’t a search, because it’s not part of the government and the communication was sent by a non government agent. The 10th Circuit politely said “bullsh*t.” NCMEC analysts are shielded from laws against viewing CSAM. That’s a privilege granted by the state to assist law enforcement. Therefore, when NCMEC analysts view CSAM, they are government actors. It’s a very interesting case, least of all because Gorsuch is an amazing writer. But it makes NCMEC look extremely disengenous, and the governments sponsorship like a way to slide around its obligations. I’m not saying NCMEC is a bad organization. I’m just saying that there is controversy. And NCMEC isn’t merely a private organization. It’s a private organization that has been delegated state powers to assist the state in performing state functions. https://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/ca10/14-3265/14-3265-2016-08-05.html https://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/ca10/1...