4 ms·

> After proving their eligibility, customers are given an identity card Eligibility checks, identity cards, someone literally stamping a record card - doesn't

> After proving their eligibility, customers are given an identity card Eligibility checks, identity cards, someone literally stamping a record card - doesn't seem very Germanic. Are so many people really going to food banks without a good reason that you need to have this authoritarianism to catch them out? If someone turns up asking for food can they not be trusted that they're probably not doing something so embarrassing for fun?

the-dude 5y ago
In NL it is no different, you actually need to prove you have insufficient income. I actually wonder where it would be more relaxed.
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  In the UK I think you just turn up and say you need food and they trust you. I'm very skeptical of the idea that rich people are putting themselves through the humiliation of saying that they aren't able to support themselves in order to get free grocery basics.
  - suction 5y ago
    Maybe well-educated, upper class rich people wouldn't. But your new-money-types totally would do that to save a couple of Euros they could spend on booze / drugs / their luxury car lease.
  - the-dude 5y ago
    I don't think the problem are rich people. I think the problem is probably poor people who try to extract more from the system ( by touring all food banks for example ). But you can always ask them ( the food banks ) if you are so skeptical. 2 other anecdata's : In the US, people are converting their food stamps into soda, because soda is more tradeable ( more liquid ) than anything else. They sell it to SMBs to convert foodstamps into money. I frequent the second hand stores which are partially aimed at the same group. They sell stuff, furniture, electronics and clothes for very low prices ( think € 3 to € 5 for a pair of pants, € 20 for a TV etc ). These shops use very very very adhesive price tags, to the point I need solvents to remove them. I asked them about it : do people really try to switch price tags on € 3 items? Yes they do.
- dekken_ 5y ago
  Do you think anyone has checked if it's cheaper to have the bureaucracy/administration rather than just not check people?
  - the-dude 5y ago
    Well, these are NGOs and they create their own policies. Why not ask them? Why do you care?
    - dekken_ 5y ago
      I care about efficiency, I'd rather have people fed than paid for work that isn't necessary.
      - the-dude 5y ago
        Are you involved in a food bank?
        dekken_ 5y ago
        Not directly, I have donated on occasion, perhaps less than I should. Feel free to ignore me, I was replying to you sure but also just shouting into the void.
        the-dude 5y ago
        That is very honest. See my sibling comment up thread for reasons to combat misuse.
markozivanovic 5y ago
You would be amazed how many people wouldn't feel a bit embarrassed taking food from a food bank even though they're not poor. I assume that some would even do it just to save some money. Then when you take into consideration that there are organized beggars and such, I believe they would also take food and try to resell it, etc. As you say, it doesn't seem very German, so I would bet that there probably was a reason to include the checks.
MandieD 5y ago
“… someone literally stamping a record card”: as someone who has lived here for over 15 years, there’s little more Germanic than someone stamping a record card.
ThePadawan 5y ago
I was born in Germany and I literally can't tell if you're joking. During the war (and still for a significant time after it!) you literally had to hand your personal ration booklet over to a merchant who'd stamp your "quarter pound of butter", hand you the butter and your ration book back. It's the most German system I could think of. Everyone's grandparents used it, and everyone's parents probably heard about it. I find it baffling that you consider it baffling.
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  > During the war Exactly - I thought German's extreme distrust of things like credit cards, identity checks, surveillance, etc, was a strong reaction against that part of their history?
  - ThePadawan 5y ago
    Well yes - this is why the food bank creates an identity card for you. So no citizen has to show them their actual national identity card. Imagine if you had to show your one ID (the one with your biometric data on it) to every single company you interacted with. If that card and data leaked, you would be ruined.
    - chrisseaton 5y ago
      But why should you show identity to any company for something like groceries? Mystery to me.
      - ThePadawan 5y ago
        ...Costco?
        chrisseaton 5y ago
        I think they're a private club - but nobody needs to shop there.
  - 5y ago
suction 5y ago
Calling need for identification "authoritarianism" is probably very edgy and cool, but totally off the mark.

the-dude 5y ago

In NL it is no different, you actually need to prove you have insufficient income. I actually wonder where it would be more relaxed.

chrisseaton 5y ago
In the UK I think you just turn up and say you need food and they trust you. I'm very skeptical of the idea that rich people are putting themselves through the humiliation of saying that they aren't able to support themselves in order to get free grocery basics.
- suction 5y ago
  Maybe well-educated, upper class rich people wouldn't. But your new-money-types totally would do that to save a couple of Euros they could spend on booze / drugs / their luxury car lease.
- the-dude 5y ago
  I don't think the problem are rich people. I think the problem is probably poor people who try to extract more from the system ( by touring all food banks for example ). But you can always ask them ( the food banks ) if you are so skeptical. 2 other anecdata's : In the US, people are converting their food stamps into soda, because soda is more tradeable ( more liquid ) than anything else. They sell it to SMBs to convert foodstamps into money. I frequent the second hand stores which are partially aimed at the same group. They sell stuff, furniture, electronics and clothes for very low prices ( think € 3 to € 5 for a pair of pants, € 20 for a TV etc ). These shops use very very very adhesive price tags, to the point I need solvents to remove them. I asked them about it : do people really try to switch price tags on € 3 items? Yes they do.
dekken_ 5y ago
Do you think anyone has checked if it's cheaper to have the bureaucracy/administration rather than just not check people?
- the-dude 5y ago
  Well, these are NGOs and they create their own policies. Why not ask them? Why do you care?
  - dekken_ 5y ago
    I care about efficiency, I'd rather have people fed than paid for work that isn't necessary.
    - the-dude 5y ago
      Are you involved in a food bank?
      - dekken_ 5y ago
        Not directly, I have donated on occasion, perhaps less than I should. Feel free to ignore me, I was replying to you sure but also just shouting into the void.
        the-dude 5y ago
        That is very honest. See my sibling comment up thread for reasons to combat misuse.

markozivanovic 5y ago

You would be amazed how many people wouldn't feel a bit embarrassed taking food from a food bank even though they're not poor. I assume that some would even do it just to save some money. Then when you take into consideration that there are organized beggars and such, I believe they would also take food and try to resell it, etc. As you say, it doesn't seem very German, so I would bet that there probably was a reason to include the checks.

MandieD 5y ago

“… someone literally stamping a record card”: as someone who has lived here for over 15 years, there’s little more Germanic than someone stamping a record card.

ThePadawan 5y ago

I was born in Germany and I literally can't tell if you're joking. During the war (and still for a significant time after it!) you literally had to hand your personal ration booklet over to a merchant who'd stamp your "quarter pound of butter", hand you the butter and your ration book back. It's the most German system I could think of. Everyone's grandparents used it, and everyone's parents probably heard about it. I find it baffling that you consider it baffling.

chrisseaton 5y ago
> During the war Exactly - I thought German's extreme distrust of things like credit cards, identity checks, surveillance, etc, was a strong reaction against that part of their history?
- ThePadawan 5y ago
  Well yes - this is why the food bank creates an identity card for you. So no citizen has to show them their actual national identity card. Imagine if you had to show your one ID (the one with your biometric data on it) to every single company you interacted with. If that card and data leaked, you would be ruined.
  - chrisseaton 5y ago
    But why should you show identity to any company for something like groceries? Mystery to me.
    - ThePadawan 5y ago
      ...Costco?
      - chrisseaton 5y ago
        I think they're a private club - but nobody needs to shop there.
- 5y ago

suction 5y ago

Calling need for identification "authoritarianism" is probably very edgy and cool, but totally off the mark.