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I think people use Bash/Sh, because there's no other default choices, much like javascript in the browser. If they switched the bash terminal to a python repl,
by nickthemagicman 5y ago
I think people use Bash/Sh, because there's no other default choices, much like javascript in the browser.
If they switched the bash terminal to a python repl, or just reliably offered stable python, that was available on every single distro, and just worked...I bet people would be fine with it.
Same with replacing JS in the browser with python or another dynamic language.
Tech people are practical and will just learn whatever they need to get things done quickly without introducing additional complexity.
But then there's the idea that todays elegant language become tomorrow's kludgy language.
So in the long run theres no winning. :)
- edgyquant 5y agoI don't think this is an apt comparison. For the last generation CMD was the "shell" on the most widely installed user OS on the planet and yet everyone who ever used bash immediately thought, "why does windows not just use this?," since it was so much nicer. Microsoft ported Linux to windows because people love the developer experience it provides. That doesn't mean that there isn't a better shell, I just don't think Javascript being the dominant web language is a good comparison.
- nickthemagicman 5y agoI've heard numerous people say PowerShell is better than bash. I think they ported bash just to bring the bash audience over to windows...not because there's any objective quality improvements. I could be wrong. There's a lot to love about bash. Just alot MORE to love about actual fully featured dynamic programming languages i think. It's interesting to think about.
- LeonB 5y agoI believe Microsoft’s move toward Linux is to make Azure competitive. Azure is a “bet the farm” strategy for Microsoft (and has been since before it launched) - they’ll do anything they need to do to make it work. (And so far it’s been a pretty good play!)
- nickthemagicman 5y agoYep. Why not make it easy for your competitors to join your ecosystem? Most deff. They got a home run with Azure.
- partdavid 5y agoPowershell is better than bash. The things that are awkward about it are also awkward in bash, and generally less so (usually having to do with quoting details). Nothing is worse than in bash. And a huge amount of things are better. It's not perfect, there are things I don't like, aesthetic things that are a little strange, but these are shortcomings compared to some imaginary perfect shell, or to some other programming language. Not compared to bash. The only advantage bash has is install base and familiarity. Which isn't nothing, but on the merits of the program itself, powershell is better. I switched a couple years ago and haven't looked back.
- cutler 5y agoPowerShell is a verbose monstrosity that could only have been produced by a corporation like Microsoft and which appeals to those who pray at the altar of OOP. There, I've said it. Please leave shell scripting nice and imperative/procedural, far from the distant sound of approaching OOP jackboots.
- partdavid 5y agoYou might like tclsh.
- nickthemagicman 5y agoI like python for that exact reason. You can get everything you want done with functions and imports. If want to OOP it's there but not convoluted. Its like OOP light.
- cutler 5y agoFor a shell substitute, though, Ruby and Perl are better due to their enhanced support for one-liners. Matz was smart enough to retain Perl's virtues when he created Ruby. Sadly Python has taken over in the same way that VHS killed-off Betamax.
- edgyquant 5y agoI almost agree, and I know the same kinds of people. That's why I mentioned CMD because powershell is more modern. I'm sure people cutting their teeth today will be more split on the subject of Powershell/Bash but my point was that no one was split on the subject of CMD and it was the "default" language for millions of people for, like, 20 years.
- exdsq 5y ago"Tech people are practical and will just learn whatever they need to get things done quickly without introducing additional complexity." Surely this is satire or I want to work where you work!
- HKH2 5y agoBash is great for quickly chaining commands and working with executables directly. Shellcheck makes it sane. I don't know of any distros that don't have Python. I just don't want to pip install anything because I'll get a hundred red lines I don't care to make sense of, and I definitely don't want to mess around with environments.
- nickthemagicman 5y agoYeah but the distro version is never certain to be python 2 or Python 3.
- HKH2 5y agoI don't know of any distros that don't have Python 3. At times I've seen 'python' linked to Python 2 for backward compatibility, but they still have Python 3.