5 ms·

I’m in the market for a TV currently, and have found (in the US) that it doesn’t matter how much extra I’d be willing to pay for a dumb TV, there just aren’t an

by jen20 5y ago

I’m in the market for a TV currently, and have found (in the US) that it doesn’t matter how much extra I’d be willing to pay for a dumb TV, there just aren’t any beyond super low-end ones. Any pointers to some would be much appreciated!

neltnerb 5y ago
I got a TV that wishes it were smart. I just refused to accept the ToS upon turning it on, never connected it to the wifi, and use an HDMI cable instead. To this day if I accidentally click the wrong input button it asks me to accept the ToS. But since I haven't and won't accept them at least that's something. Though I think it should be extremely illegal to change the terms of service for an appliance. Software maybe, a service maybe, but not a washing machine or TV! What are you supposed to do if you disagree, try to return it 3 years after purchase? Will the manufacturer pay for you to spend your time packing it up to send back to them for a full refund (of purchase price)? Of course not. The warranty and return periods are up, you have no choices.
- notrealpersonq 5y ago
  This is the heart of the question. My return period is long past. And it's a pretty expensive device. In my mind: I purchased the washer/dryer with these specific features in mind. Now I no longer have access to what I bought and I'm being locked out of using these features unless I accept the new terms.
  - cosmotic 5y ago
    Their official return window may have passed, but that doesn't mean you can't return now that they have changed the terms of the sale.
- mnw21cam 5y ago
  Nonsense. Sale of goods act 1979, and the consumer rights act 2015. If the terms of service are acceptable to you at the time you buy, but then they are changed to be unacceptable, then the device is not fit for purpose by design, and you can claim a full refund. There is no set time limit on this. Take them to the small claims court if they refuse.
  - neltnerb 5y ago
    ... have you ever tried to actually do this? On top of having to deal with, at minimum, going out and buying a new washer drier on my own dime until I win said court case, there's no guarantee you'd win (it's the app ToS, not literally the appliance, correct?) nor that it would ever compensate for your time spent dealing with it. Sure, you might have a good case, but when you're working full time and have a family this is not a good use of your time. It requires a level of committment that I shouldn't have to have in order to fix a unilateral change to the terms I agree to when actually making a literally $2k+ purchase. I can't just float them a loan for $2k to buy replacement equipment while suing them.
JohnFen 5y ago
It depends on how large you want your TV, but I know a couple of people who've purchased monitors instead of TVs and used them as TVs.
jrockway 5y ago
There are dumb TVs; they're for digital signage. My impression from investigating these is that you get a $100 TV quality panel for $10,000, so not really an option. I have a smart TV and it's simply never been connected to the Internet. That makes it pretty dumb.
- buu700 5y ago
  It took me way too long[1] to figure out that "digital signage" means physical signs, not that display manufacturers are now jacking up their rates for models that won't backdoor your system and exfiltrate your private keys. --- 1: As in I was halfway through writing a comment to ask how these were sufficiently different from regular monitors to justify that markup, before realizing that I'm an idiot.
MiddleEndian 5y ago
Just never give your TV any network access, use it like a monitor.
zxexz 5y ago
I have had this[0] LG monitor as my TV for about 3 years now. Still going strong, no issues at all. Has no WiFi, Bluetooth, etc. Just a monitor. Great picture quality, IMO. [0] https://www.amazon.com/LG-Electronics-LED-lit-Monitor-43UD79-B/dp/B0711MP768 https://www.amazon.com/LG-Electronics-LED-lit-Monitor-43UD79...
mschild 5y ago
Besides going with the common low-budget brands, like Sceptre, you might find some dumb commercial TVs. However, commercial TVs leave a lot to be desired. They generally put the focus on other aspect, like higher brightness, instead of color accuracy because they are intended to be used as signage. Hotel TVs tend to have hidden and hard to navigate sub-menus so guests dont mess with the settings too much. Realistically, its easier to get a smart TV and just not connect it to the internet. Google TV is also coming with a Basic TV mode for their Sony and TCL models. Basic mode is supposed to reduce the menus to a few basic functions like input switching, etc. [0] [0]https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/02/the-best-feature-of-google-tv-you-can-turn-it-off-for-a-dumb-tv-mode/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/02/the-best-feature-of-...
- ipaddr 5y ago
  I don't think a google tv is the best way forward in terms of privacy.
mongol 5y ago
I have no idea but my TV has service menus which seems very advanced. Google your TV brand + service manual and you may find something.
octopoc 5y ago
I saw a post on social media awhile ago about dumb TVs available here: https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.html https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.htm... I haven't investigated fully but they don't mention WiFi or YouTube support on the few products I checked.

by jen20 5y ago

neltnerb 5y ago

I got a TV that wishes it were smart. I just refused to accept the ToS upon turning it on, never connected it to the wifi, and use an HDMI cable instead. To this day if I accidentally click the wrong input button it asks me to accept the ToS. But since I haven't and won't accept them at least that's something. Though I think it should be extremely illegal to change the terms of service for an appliance. Software maybe, a service maybe, but not a washing machine or TV! What are you supposed to do if you disagree, try to return it 3 years after purchase? Will the manufacturer pay for you to spend your time packing it up to send back to them for a full refund (of purchase price)? Of course not. The warranty and return periods are up, you have no choices.

notrealpersonq 5y ago
This is the heart of the question. My return period is long past. And it's a pretty expensive device. In my mind: I purchased the washer/dryer with these specific features in mind. Now I no longer have access to what I bought and I'm being locked out of using these features unless I accept the new terms.
- cosmotic 5y ago
  Their official return window may have passed, but that doesn't mean you can't return now that they have changed the terms of the sale.
mnw21cam 5y ago
Nonsense. Sale of goods act 1979, and the consumer rights act 2015. If the terms of service are acceptable to you at the time you buy, but then they are changed to be unacceptable, then the device is not fit for purpose by design, and you can claim a full refund. There is no set time limit on this. Take them to the small claims court if they refuse.
- neltnerb 5y ago
  ... have you ever tried to actually do this? On top of having to deal with, at minimum, going out and buying a new washer drier on my own dime until I win said court case, there's no guarantee you'd win (it's the app ToS, not literally the appliance, correct?) nor that it would ever compensate for your time spent dealing with it. Sure, you might have a good case, but when you're working full time and have a family this is not a good use of your time. It requires a level of committment that I shouldn't have to have in order to fix a unilateral change to the terms I agree to when actually making a literally $2k+ purchase. I can't just float them a loan for $2k to buy replacement equipment while suing them.

JohnFen 5y ago

It depends on how large you want your TV, but I know a couple of people who've purchased monitors instead of TVs and used them as TVs.

jrockway 5y ago

There are dumb TVs; they're for digital signage. My impression from investigating these is that you get a $100 TV quality panel for $10,000, so not really an option. I have a smart TV and it's simply never been connected to the Internet. That makes it pretty dumb.

buu700 5y ago
It took me way too long[1] to figure out that "digital signage" means physical signs, not that display manufacturers are now jacking up their rates for models that won't backdoor your system and exfiltrate your private keys. --- 1: As in I was halfway through writing a comment to ask how these were sufficiently different from regular monitors to justify that markup, before realizing that I'm an idiot.

MiddleEndian 5y ago

Just never give your TV any network access, use it like a monitor.

zxexz 5y ago

I have had this[0] LG monitor as my TV for about 3 years now. Still going strong, no issues at all. Has no WiFi, Bluetooth, etc. Just a monitor. Great picture quality, IMO. [0] https://www.amazon.com/LG-Electronics-LED-lit-Monitor-43UD79-B/dp/B0711MP768 https://www.amazon.com/LG-Electronics-LED-lit-Monitor-43UD79...

mschild 5y ago

Besides going with the common low-budget brands, like Sceptre, you might find some dumb commercial TVs. However, commercial TVs leave a lot to be desired. They generally put the focus on other aspect, like higher brightness, instead of color accuracy because they are intended to be used as signage. Hotel TVs tend to have hidden and hard to navigate sub-menus so guests dont mess with the settings too much. Realistically, its easier to get a smart TV and just not connect it to the internet. Google TV is also coming with a Basic TV mode for their Sony and TCL models. Basic mode is supposed to reduce the menus to a few basic functions like input switching, etc. [0] [0]https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/02/the-best-feature-of-google-tv-you-can-turn-it-off-for-a-dumb-tv-mode/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/02/the-best-feature-of-...

ipaddr 5y ago
I don't think a google tv is the best way forward in terms of privacy.

mongol 5y ago

I have no idea but my TV has service menus which seems very advanced. Google your TV brand + service manual and you may find something.

octopoc 5y ago

I saw a post on social media awhile ago about dumb TVs available here: https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.html https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.htm... I haven't investigated fully but they don't mention WiFi or YouTube support on the few products I checked.