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C++ supports platforms multiple degrees more complex than other languages. You're not gonna use Rust or Zig to write code for some obscure DSP CPU with a ridic

C++ supports platforms multiple degrees more complex than other languages. You're not gonna use Rust or Zig to write code for some obscure DSP CPU with a ridiculous architecture and no OS.

tialaramex 5y ago
Actually, maybe you would choose Rust. The core consideration is going to be whether somebody is going to target LLVM on that CPU. If the CPU has a perfectly nice GCC backend then maybe Rust is a bad choice, but if it's LLVM anyway, or if "land an actual high level language on this hardware so that I don't need to write machine code by hand" is part of the goal of your work anyway, then Rust looks reasonable. Of course with no OS you can't run Rust's standard library as this expects OS services to underpin it. But you can have core features, and if you've got "no OS" you presumably were expecting to write anything you needed anyway. The reality for modern C++ is that you're on a Microsoft platform, or you're on GCC, or you're on Clang, there is no fourth vendor - you are screwed and nothing works. The era of $$$ proprietary compilers for weird targets on C++ ended and isn't coming back, C++ got too complicated for them and they gradually stopped implementing new features. But if you're on Clang you already have LLVM, which is a long way toward having Rust. If you're on a Microsoft platform that is the OS, I know, seems like they could do more but they didn't. When you say "ridiculous architecture" if you got too far off piste you can't have modern C++ either. Even as you stray into the black zone stuff gets very fragile and I wouldn't risk it. Your CPU integer arithmetic isn't technically required to be two's complement for example, but good luck fixing all the weird things that break if it isn't.
dathinab 5y ago
What I heard from people working with obscure - They often don't support any C/C++ compiler. - If they support a fully custom one it's often not that grate. Potentially limited to C or even a subset of C (or a very small subset of C++) - If they base it on gcc/llvm either they are not too obscure or you sooner or later run into compiler bugs. Also in that case it's not too much of a stretch to e.g. support Rust instead of C++ if you want to.

C++ supports platforms multiple degrees more complex than other languages. You're not gonna use Rust or Zig to write code for some obscure DSP CPU with a ridiculous architecture and no OS.

tialaramex 5y ago

Actually, maybe you would choose Rust. The core consideration is going to be whether somebody is going to target LLVM on that CPU. If the CPU has a perfectly nice GCC backend then maybe Rust is a bad choice, but if it's LLVM anyway, or if "land an actual high level language on this hardware so that I don't need to write machine code by hand" is part of the goal of your work anyway, then Rust looks reasonable. Of course with no OS you can't run Rust's standard library as this expects OS services to underpin it. But you can have core features, and if you've got "no OS" you presumably were expecting to write anything you needed anyway. The reality for modern C++ is that you're on a Microsoft platform, or you're on GCC, or you're on Clang, there is no fourth vendor - you are screwed and nothing works. The era of $$$ proprietary compilers for weird targets on C++ ended and isn't coming back, C++ got too complicated for them and they gradually stopped implementing new features. But if you're on Clang you already have LLVM, which is a long way toward having Rust. If you're on a Microsoft platform that is the OS, I know, seems like they could do more but they didn't. When you say "ridiculous architecture" if you got too far off piste you can't have modern C++ either. Even as you stray into the black zone stuff gets very fragile and I wouldn't risk it. Your CPU integer arithmetic isn't technically required to be two's complement for example, but good luck fixing all the weird things that break if it isn't.

dathinab 5y ago

What I heard from people working with obscure - They often don't support any C/C++ compiler. - If they support a fully custom one it's often not that grate. Potentially limited to C or even a subset of C (or a very small subset of C++) - If they base it on gcc/llvm either they are not too obscure or you sooner or later run into compiler bugs. Also in that case it's not too much of a stretch to e.g. support Rust instead of C++ if you want to.