5 ms·

Microsoft is making it harder to switch default browsers in Windows 11

54 points by LopRabbit 5y ago

SunlightEdge 5y ago
Its an obvious move from M$ - I'm wondering: 1. What if M$ just blatantly made it so hard to switch default browsers and didn't care about being sued (they could battle it out in courts with google etc. for years and just pay a big fine at some point). Its hard to say for sure but that big fine might be cheap in comparison. 2. Doesn't do anything about mobile - Be interested in the search market - phone vs PC split here. 3. Technically interested in how M$ try to make it harder. Google etc. can always throw in a solution too (e.g. making users re-install their browser and tick the make main browser etc.)
richev 5y ago
Old habits... :/
Jyaif 5y ago
They stand to earn hundreds of millions more per year with Bing from this small UI change. Recent history has shown that there are no significant drawbacks to behaving this way, so from Microsoft's point of view it would be stupid not to do it.
- llampx 5y ago
  I'm happy for any competition to google in the search space, when many search engines have turned into frontends for google, and many browsers have turned into frontends for Chrome.
  - heurisko 5y ago
    Microsoft's Edge is also a frontend to Chrome. I would also prefer competition that is based on giving better search results, rather than abusing the fact that you own the operating system.
mikeyla85 5y ago
I remember the 90s
toivo 5y ago
Windows 10 will be the last windows I use.
Geenirvana 5y ago
Frustrating for the tech user. Very frustrating for the none tech user. Probably intentional, as when someone does not understand something, there is a good chance it will be ignored. I'm all for having the ability to make fine-tuned changes to settings, but these need to be under some kind of advanced dialog in my opinion. This UI change shows no indication (for example) what a .svg file is, or what a .shtml file is. How on earth can a none tech user know what these mean when by default file extensions are hidden on Windows. I work with many people who simply do not know what file extensions are.
perryizgr8 5y ago
Makes sense. Since apple is allowed to disallow any other browser in ios, why should MS restrain itself? I'm sure if apple actually gets some anti-trust action, MS would go back on this.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- bpye 5y ago
  Apple do let you change the default now, but the engine must be the same.
  - ChuckNorris89 5y ago
    Basically only reskinned versions of the Apple browser are allowed. How is that any better?
- GekkePrutser 5y ago
  Apple doesn't have a de facto monopoly on the mobile OS market. They have a small majority in the US but everywhere else they're much lower. There's no one big player that dominates the market. Microsoft does on the desktop market. Like 95% . This is why antitrust rules were applied to them before and hopefully will be again.
lenkite 5y ago
Well since Apple gets away scot-free and legions of Apple fans defend Apple's policy to the death, one can fully understand why Microsoft is going this route. They can always point to Apple being the deeply-admired trend-setter for removal of choice. You can use any browser of your choice if its a Microsoft Edge theme. You can always switch operating systems if you don't like this after all.
- ChuckNorris89 5y ago
  It always baffled me how Apple is allowed to limit its users to only browsers based on its proprietary engine and nobody bats an eye but everyone throws a fit when Microsoft pushes Edge. Not trying to defend either, it's just the double standards feel puzzling to me.
  - akudha 5y ago
    Apple removes headphone jack. Others follow suit, shamelessly, after mocking Apple. They make repairing their devices near impossible, others follow. And on and on.
  - aNoob7000 5y ago
    I agree with you that Apple should be held to a different standard on their iPhone platform, but Microsoft Windows came up during a different era and is basically a monopoly on the desktop. Right now, Apple's smartphone market share in the USA is only 50%. Microsoft's Windows is probably at 80%+ of the desktop market.
- pomian 5y ago
  Can you no longer use Firefox under the new Mac OS? Or iOS? (I haven't had to troubleshoot anyone's new-er Mac for awhile. It used to be a staple energy drain on time resources, but everyone I'm exposed to, is trying not to upgrade.)
  - aNoob7000 5y ago
    I'm running the latest version of Firefox on a Mac mini with M1 processor. They are talking about iOS.
GekkePrutser 5y ago
I won't use edge for this reason alone. Perhaps it's not a bad browser but I don't want to reward Microsoft's behaviour. I use it at work on my Mac as it's our official browser at work (after significant pressure from Microsoft) but for personal use I greatly prefer Firefox. It's a much better browser anyway.
moss2 5y ago
I smell an anti-competitive lawsuit in the air.
simonblack 5y ago
We have been increasingly worried about the trend on Windows,” says Selena Deckelmann, senior vice president of Firefox, in a statement to The Verge. “Since Windows 10, users have had to take additional and unnecessary steps to set and retain their default browser settings. These barriers are confusing at best and seem designed to undermine a user’s choice for a non-Microsoft browser.” Come on. Those of us who are a little older remember when this browser lock-in was Microsoft's SOP in the 90s. And not just browsers. MSFT has used lots of dirty tricks to fool their customers and thus lock them into using their DOS ('AARD'), their 'Java', their disk-compression, and other different stuff since 1975. People keep saying 'It's a new Microsoft. They are much better than they used to be' - but I keep seeing the dirty tricks returning over and over again. Maybe one day they will change. But I don't see that day any time soon.

54 points by LopRabbit 5y ago

Its an obvious move from M$ - I'm wondering: 1. What if M$ just blatantly made it so hard to switch default browsers and didn't care about being sued (they could battle it out in courts with google etc. for years and just pay a big fine at some point). Its hard to say for sure but that big fine might be cheap in comparison. 2. Doesn't do anything about mobile - Be interested in the search market - phone vs PC split here. 3. Technically interested in how M$ try to make it harder. Google etc. can always throw in a solution too (e.g. making users re-install their browser and tick the make main browser etc.)

richev 5y ago

Old habits... :/

Jyaif 5y ago

They stand to earn hundreds of millions more per year with Bing from this small UI change. Recent history has shown that there are no significant drawbacks to behaving this way, so from Microsoft's point of view it would be stupid not to do it.

llampx 5y ago
I'm happy for any competition to google in the search space, when many search engines have turned into frontends for google, and many browsers have turned into frontends for Chrome.
- heurisko 5y ago
  Microsoft's Edge is also a frontend to Chrome. I would also prefer competition that is based on giving better search results, rather than abusing the fact that you own the operating system.

mikeyla85 5y ago

I remember the 90s

toivo 5y ago

Windows 10 will be the last windows I use.

Geenirvana 5y ago

Frustrating for the tech user. Very frustrating for the none tech user. Probably intentional, as when someone does not understand something, there is a good chance it will be ignored. I'm all for having the ability to make fine-tuned changes to settings, but these need to be under some kind of advanced dialog in my opinion. This UI change shows no indication (for example) what a .svg file is, or what a .shtml file is. How on earth can a none tech user know what these mean when by default file extensions are hidden on Windows. I work with many people who simply do not know what file extensions are.

perryizgr8 5y ago

Makes sense. Since apple is allowed to disallow any other browser in ios, why should MS restrain itself? I'm sure if apple actually gets some anti-trust action, MS would go back on this.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
bpye 5y ago
Apple do let you change the default now, but the engine must be the same.
- ChuckNorris89 5y ago
  Basically only reskinned versions of the Apple browser are allowed. How is that any better?
GekkePrutser 5y ago
Apple doesn't have a de facto monopoly on the mobile OS market. They have a small majority in the US but everywhere else they're much lower. There's no one big player that dominates the market. Microsoft does on the desktop market. Like 95% . This is why antitrust rules were applied to them before and hopefully will be again.

lenkite 5y ago

Well since Apple gets away scot-free and legions of Apple fans defend Apple's policy to the death, one can fully understand why Microsoft is going this route. They can always point to Apple being the deeply-admired trend-setter for removal of choice. You can use any browser of your choice if its a Microsoft Edge theme. You can always switch operating systems if you don't like this after all.

ChuckNorris89 5y ago
It always baffled me how Apple is allowed to limit its users to only browsers based on its proprietary engine and nobody bats an eye but everyone throws a fit when Microsoft pushes Edge. Not trying to defend either, it's just the double standards feel puzzling to me.
- akudha 5y ago
  Apple removes headphone jack. Others follow suit, shamelessly, after mocking Apple. They make repairing their devices near impossible, others follow. And on and on.
- aNoob7000 5y ago
  I agree with you that Apple should be held to a different standard on their iPhone platform, but Microsoft Windows came up during a different era and is basically a monopoly on the desktop. Right now, Apple's smartphone market share in the USA is only 50%. Microsoft's Windows is probably at 80%+ of the desktop market.
pomian 5y ago
Can you no longer use Firefox under the new Mac OS? Or iOS? (I haven't had to troubleshoot anyone's new-er Mac for awhile. It used to be a staple energy drain on time resources, but everyone I'm exposed to, is trying not to upgrade.)
- aNoob7000 5y ago
  I'm running the latest version of Firefox on a Mac mini with M1 processor. They are talking about iOS.

GekkePrutser 5y ago

I won't use edge for this reason alone. Perhaps it's not a bad browser but I don't want to reward Microsoft's behaviour. I use it at work on my Mac as it's our official browser at work (after significant pressure from Microsoft) but for personal use I greatly prefer Firefox. It's a much better browser anyway.

moss2 5y ago

I smell an anti-competitive lawsuit in the air.

simonblack 5y ago

We have been increasingly worried about the trend on Windows,” says Selena Deckelmann, senior vice president of Firefox, in a statement to The Verge. “Since Windows 10, users have had to take additional and unnecessary steps to set and retain their default browser settings. These barriers are confusing at best and seem designed to undermine a user’s choice for a non-Microsoft browser.” Come on. Those of us who are a little older remember when this browser lock-in was Microsoft's SOP in the 90s. And not just browsers. MSFT has used lots of dirty tricks to fool their customers and thus lock them into using their DOS ('AARD'), their 'Java', their disk-compression, and other different stuff since 1975. People keep saying 'It's a new Microsoft. They are much better than they used to be' - but I keep seeing the dirty tricks returning over and over again. Maybe one day they will change. But I don't see that day any time soon.