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The NYTimes barely mentions the data. Here's the original article that talks about the ROI: https://www.thirdway.org/report/which-college-programs-give-student

The NYTimes barely mentions the data. Here's the original article that talks about the ROI: https://www.thirdway.org/report/which-college-programs-give-students-the-best-bang-for-their-buck https://www.thirdway.org/report/which-college-programs-give-... I think the most alarming thing is the "For Profit" section of the charts. 40% (of students) don't recoup their cost ever vs 13% in Private and 8% in public. "For Profit" schools prey on the venerable to take out huge loans for a degree from "City University" or ITT Tech (defunct) with the promise that you could make a lot of money "just like our 1 person we put in all our commercials." I'm glad a number were shut down, but there are still too many that operate.

notsureaboutpg 5y ago
If 60% of for profit students recoup their cost (and then go on to earn more because of their investment), then isn't it still a valuable investment to have available overall?
Empact 5y ago
For-profit schools also take on more marginal students, who may be less likely to prosper in any case. My father, admittedly an outlier, went from growing up in poverty, to ITT Tech, to Marquette (a Catholic University), to a Ph.D. from U of I Urbana-Champaign in one long continuous path of transfers. It’s not clear to me that he would have achieved what he did without the initial venue to acquire and demonstrate skills, but I could see how many might not travel that path. To what extent can we really weigh the experiences of those who do net benefit (presumably the 60%) against those who do not? Perhaps one man’s preying is the answer to another man’s prayers.
- irjustin 5y ago
  Not to diminish what your father has accomplished because it is rightfully amazing, but a possible question to whether your father needed ITT there? Could there be another avenue through a community college or other non-profit system? > Perhaps one man’s preying is the answer to another man’s prayers. I reject this premise. This is a really poor justification for preying. So many lives were destroyed that ITT was forcibly shut down.

notsureaboutpg 5y ago

If 60% of for profit students recoup their cost (and then go on to earn more because of their investment), then isn't it still a valuable investment to have available overall?

Empact 5y ago

For-profit schools also take on more marginal students, who may be less likely to prosper in any case. My father, admittedly an outlier, went from growing up in poverty, to ITT Tech, to Marquette (a Catholic University), to a Ph.D. from U of I Urbana-Champaign in one long continuous path of transfers. It’s not clear to me that he would have achieved what he did without the initial venue to acquire and demonstrate skills, but I could see how many might not travel that path. To what extent can we really weigh the experiences of those who do net benefit (presumably the 60%) against those who do not? Perhaps one man’s preying is the answer to another man’s prayers.

irjustin 5y ago
Not to diminish what your father has accomplished because it is rightfully amazing, but a possible question to whether your father needed ITT there? Could there be another avenue through a community college or other non-profit system? > Perhaps one man’s preying is the answer to another man’s prayers. I reject this premise. This is a really poor justification for preying. So many lives were destroyed that ITT was forcibly shut down.