4 ms·

85% of patients currently hospitalized for COVID-19 in Oregon have not received any dose of the available vaccines [1]. Oregon hospitals are almost at capacity

85% of patients currently hospitalized for COVID-19 in Oregon have not received any dose of the available vaccines [1]. Oregon hospitals are almost at capacity for ICU beds and are expected to exceed capacity soon. The consequences are drastic for anyone requiring hospitalization; essentially you have to wait for an available bed (e.g. wait for its occupant to die or be discharged) or be flown to a hospital with capacity. TL;DR: The unvaccinated are using 6 times the available medical care capacity of the vaccinated and are impacting the health outcomes for anyone who needs access to those medical resources, not just those who are suffering from a COVID-19 infection. [1]: https://www.ohsu.edu/sites/default/files/2021-08/Oregon-Trends_20210810b.pdf https://www.ohsu.edu/sites/default/files/2021-08/Oregon-Tren...

vkou 5y ago
Why are we wasting limited medical resources on people who refuse to take the full COVID treatment regimen? (Which starts with vaccination.) If we had limited ability to treat cancer patients, and someone refused treatment of their Phase 1 cancer, we wouldn't give them a bed over someone else, when they come back to the hospital in Phase 3. There are trauma victims waiting in ERs, who can't get treatment because of this self-inflicted disaster. There are people waiting on life-saving surgeries, who can't come in for them, because all the doctors are busy, and all the beds are full. Not getting vaccinated is a choice, but choices should have consequences.
- jmnicolas 5y ago
  What about drug addicts, alcoholics, extreme sports people we let them die too? This is called solidarity, we pay taxes for that too. Anyway I would still take my chance.
  - vkou 5y ago
    Can we expect that people who aren't vaccinated show some solidarity... And vaccinate themselves? Solidarity with defectors only works when there are enough resources for everyone. When there aren't, we triage. First come first serve, at the expense of people who have not defected is a stupid way to allocate those resources, when there's such a simple preventative measure available.
  - tadfisher 5y ago
    If drastically reducing the incidence of drug/alcohol addiction and sports injuries was as easy as administering 2 shots, we wouldn't be having this discussion. It is ultimately your choice. Just understand that others making the same choice are currently filling up hospital beds. The numbers don't lie.
- Dma54rhs 5y ago
  Probably for the same reason why you don't reject obese people. 1.5 yrs of pandemic is a lot of time to lose weight and help with overloading hospitals. They should start using scales in front of pubs too or measure body fat :)
  - vkou 5y ago
    If obesity were preventable by two free shots, and the ICUs were flooded by an obesity epidemic, I'd consider it acceptable to take that into consideration during triage, too.
    - Dma54rhs 5y ago
      Obesity is the biggest co factor for people over flooding the ICUs, hence my comment. It's preventable by eating less.
      - vkou 5y ago
        Eating less isn't that simple, there's a bloody powerful biological imperative to eat, and modern diets, plus industrialized societies hijack a lot of the negative feedback loops that are supposed to prevent us from overeating... Also, crappy, addictive junk food - or empty carbs - tend to be the most affordable option at the grocery. Vaccination is two free ten-minute appointments at any doctor's office, UCU, or grocery. Comparing the two the way you do severely undersells why obesity is such a difficult problem to solve. If it could be solved by two free shots, it wouldn't be a difficult problem to solve.
        mensetmanusman 5y ago
        For some people eating less is easier than getting vaccines. I know people who have panic attacks over the thought (they had to be put under to get vaccinated). Also, lots of people come from communities that were experimented on by big pharma which explains rate differences amongst races.
        5y ago

vkou 5y ago

Why are we wasting limited medical resources on people who refuse to take the full COVID treatment regimen? (Which starts with vaccination.) If we had limited ability to treat cancer patients, and someone refused treatment of their Phase 1 cancer, we wouldn't give them a bed over someone else, when they come back to the hospital in Phase 3. There are trauma victims waiting in ERs, who can't get treatment because of this self-inflicted disaster. There are people waiting on life-saving surgeries, who can't come in for them, because all the doctors are busy, and all the beds are full. Not getting vaccinated is a choice, but choices should have consequences.

jmnicolas 5y ago
What about drug addicts, alcoholics, extreme sports people we let them die too? This is called solidarity, we pay taxes for that too. Anyway I would still take my chance.
- vkou 5y ago
  Can we expect that people who aren't vaccinated show some solidarity... And vaccinate themselves? Solidarity with defectors only works when there are enough resources for everyone. When there aren't, we triage. First come first serve, at the expense of people who have not defected is a stupid way to allocate those resources, when there's such a simple preventative measure available.
- tadfisher 5y ago
  If drastically reducing the incidence of drug/alcohol addiction and sports injuries was as easy as administering 2 shots, we wouldn't be having this discussion. It is ultimately your choice. Just understand that others making the same choice are currently filling up hospital beds. The numbers don't lie.
Dma54rhs 5y ago
Probably for the same reason why you don't reject obese people. 1.5 yrs of pandemic is a lot of time to lose weight and help with overloading hospitals. They should start using scales in front of pubs too or measure body fat :)
- vkou 5y ago
  If obesity were preventable by two free shots, and the ICUs were flooded by an obesity epidemic, I'd consider it acceptable to take that into consideration during triage, too.
  - Dma54rhs 5y ago
    Obesity is the biggest co factor for people over flooding the ICUs, hence my comment. It's preventable by eating less.
    - vkou 5y ago
      Eating less isn't that simple, there's a bloody powerful biological imperative to eat, and modern diets, plus industrialized societies hijack a lot of the negative feedback loops that are supposed to prevent us from overeating... Also, crappy, addictive junk food - or empty carbs - tend to be the most affordable option at the grocery. Vaccination is two free ten-minute appointments at any doctor's office, UCU, or grocery. Comparing the two the way you do severely undersells why obesity is such a difficult problem to solve. If it could be solved by two free shots, it wouldn't be a difficult problem to solve.
      - mensetmanusman 5y ago
        For some people eating less is easier than getting vaccines. I know people who have panic attacks over the thought (they had to be put under to get vaccinated). Also, lots of people come from communities that were experimented on by big pharma which explains rate differences amongst races.
        5y ago