5 ms·

Will the two shot people lose their jobs next year if they refuse the third shot? I’d rather have robust variety of antibodies provided by prior infection than

Will the two shot people lose their jobs next year if they refuse the third shot? I’d rather have robust variety of antibodies provided by prior infection than get a leaky vaccine every 8 months. Sucks that I’m going to lose my job for that decision but having a IaaS (Immunity as a Service) subscription from Pharma sounds worse than getting longcovid again.

revolvingocelot 5y ago
>I’d rather have robust variety of antibodies provided by prior infection than get a leaky vaccine every 8 months. Sucks that I’m going to lose my job for that decision but having a IaaS (Immunity as a Service) subscription from Pharma sounds worse than getting longcovid again. Er, what? It sounds like you're saying that you'd rather get COVID-resistance from a bout with COVID rather than from a vaccine, but then you suggest that you've already had COVID and that you'd prefer to experience COVID complications again. The suspicious doubletalk aside, aren't the double-vaxxed currently doomed to risk a (mild, potentially infectious) Delta experience anyway? How's the resistance gained thereby stack up? Why's this an issue, anyway? Are you having to pay for your shots, or something? Or is this a "principled" stance? edit: probable answers to the personal questions I have of the parent can be found in this thread of theirs a few days ago. If the events of the past year and a half weren't enough to make any readers worried about trust in social institutions, reading this will: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27986681 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27986681
- evilpotatoes 5y ago
  That's a really good question I'd like the answer to. I was reading that natural infection tends to create a stronger response against the nucleocapsid for t-cells. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.19.21255739v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.19.21255739v... Is this an either or thing? Will your immune system develop proper full immunity after getting vaccine + delta ?
- silent_cal 5y ago
  He's saying he'd rather depend on his natural immunity than be mandatorily jabbed over and over again.
  - revolvingocelot 5y ago
    What natural immunity? He implies that he's already got two vaccine shots, and would rather lose his job than get a third... Will his vaccine-induced resistance to the virus result in a more robust protection, after the immune system successfully fights off the Delta infection he'll surely eventually get? Or will the immunity fade, leaving him at an unvaccinated-like risk some time in the future? Given the chance of the latter, and given that he's likely already gotten two, I just don't understand the logic -- unless one's willing to venture into slightly paranoid territory, as I note above.
    - halfjoking 5y ago
      I didn't get any shots. I had longcovid from Mar 2020 - Jun 2021. I think having the shot will ruin my robust immunity. If you train your immune system to create very specific antibodies to one part of the virus, that is already being evaded by breakthrough infections btw - you will be more susceptible to variants. Anyone who had covid and takes this vaccine is ruining their existing immunity IMO - but people can do what they want, just don't force it on me.
      - AndrewBissell 5y ago
        > Anyone who had covid and takes this vaccine is ruining their existing immunity IMO "Ruining" may be too strong a word but something like this has already been observed with the second Pfizer dose: https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.22.436441v1 https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.22.436441v1
        revolvingocelot 5y ago
        I note that the parent doesn't attempt to provide a summary. I'm no immunologist but it seems to me that this study examines a third-order consequence (levels of IFN-gamma in whole blood samples) to infer a second-level consequence (levels of CD4 helper and CD8 cytotoxic T-cells, which are secreting the IFN-gamma), which is presumed to be indicative of a root-level occurance ("a detrimental effect in the overall magnitude of the spike-specific humoral response in COVID-19 recovered individuals"). It's not clear to me how the second order consequence clearly implies the root-level occurance. This [0] is the paper in the fifth citation from the parent's article. It seems to come to similiar conclusions, but, like the parent's article, doesn't assess any real world data, just lab conditions and inferences. I urge everyone reading this to remind themselves of the specific language used in these articles -- they don't actually know whether these correlates they're observing are affecting immunity, just one component of what we consider to be a single aspect of an appropriate immune response in a blood sample. Does my linked article, above and in a different thread, also measure blood sample conditions? Absolutely. But the article I linked directly analyses (spike protein) antibody levels -- an appropriate immune response in a blood sample -- while the articles here examine inferred T cell presence. One is a direct measure of something straightforward, and the other an inferential examination of something complex. [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7885942.1/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7885942.1/
QuadmasterXLII 5y ago
????????
csb6 5y ago
Who said you are going to lose your job? You seem to accept that as a fact, but I’m not sure where you are getting confirmation of this. Are you just assuming that all employers will require you to get a booster shot in the future, even though as of now most employers do not require you to get even a single COVID shot?
- silent_cal 5y ago
  People are already losing their jobs over these vaccines.
- halfjoking 5y ago
  My employer has a mandate so it looks like I'm going to be fired in October. I didn't take the vaccine and won't be taking it.
  - IAmGraydon 5y ago
    I really cannot overstate how stupid it would be to lose your job over this. What, exactly, do you think the vaccine is going to do to you?

revolvingocelot 5y ago

>I’d rather have robust variety of antibodies provided by prior infection than get a leaky vaccine every 8 months. Sucks that I’m going to lose my job for that decision but having a IaaS (Immunity as a Service) subscription from Pharma sounds worse than getting longcovid again. Er, what? It sounds like you're saying that you'd rather get COVID-resistance from a bout with COVID rather than from a vaccine, but then you suggest that you've already had COVID and that you'd prefer to experience COVID complications again. The suspicious doubletalk aside, aren't the double-vaxxed currently doomed to risk a (mild, potentially infectious) Delta experience anyway? How's the resistance gained thereby stack up? Why's this an issue, anyway? Are you having to pay for your shots, or something? Or is this a "principled" stance? edit: probable answers to the personal questions I have of the parent can be found in this thread of theirs a few days ago. If the events of the past year and a half weren't enough to make any readers worried about trust in social institutions, reading this will: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27986681 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27986681

evilpotatoes 5y ago
That's a really good question I'd like the answer to. I was reading that natural infection tends to create a stronger response against the nucleocapsid for t-cells. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.19.21255739v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.19.21255739v... Is this an either or thing? Will your immune system develop proper full immunity after getting vaccine + delta ?
silent_cal 5y ago
He's saying he'd rather depend on his natural immunity than be mandatorily jabbed over and over again.
- revolvingocelot 5y ago
  What natural immunity? He implies that he's already got two vaccine shots, and would rather lose his job than get a third... Will his vaccine-induced resistance to the virus result in a more robust protection, after the immune system successfully fights off the Delta infection he'll surely eventually get? Or will the immunity fade, leaving him at an unvaccinated-like risk some time in the future? Given the chance of the latter, and given that he's likely already gotten two, I just don't understand the logic -- unless one's willing to venture into slightly paranoid territory, as I note above.
  - halfjoking 5y ago
    I didn't get any shots. I had longcovid from Mar 2020 - Jun 2021. I think having the shot will ruin my robust immunity. If you train your immune system to create very specific antibodies to one part of the virus, that is already being evaded by breakthrough infections btw - you will be more susceptible to variants. Anyone who had covid and takes this vaccine is ruining their existing immunity IMO - but people can do what they want, just don't force it on me.
    - AndrewBissell 5y ago
      > Anyone who had covid and takes this vaccine is ruining their existing immunity IMO "Ruining" may be too strong a word but something like this has already been observed with the second Pfizer dose: https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.22.436441v1 https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.22.436441v1
      - revolvingocelot 5y ago
        I note that the parent doesn't attempt to provide a summary. I'm no immunologist but it seems to me that this study examines a third-order consequence (levels of IFN-gamma in whole blood samples) to infer a second-level consequence (levels of CD4 helper and CD8 cytotoxic T-cells, which are secreting the IFN-gamma), which is presumed to be indicative of a root-level occurance ("a detrimental effect in the overall magnitude of the spike-specific humoral response in COVID-19 recovered individuals"). It's not clear to me how the second order consequence clearly implies the root-level occurance. This [0] is the paper in the fifth citation from the parent's article. It seems to come to similiar conclusions, but, like the parent's article, doesn't assess any real world data, just lab conditions and inferences. I urge everyone reading this to remind themselves of the specific language used in these articles -- they don't actually know whether these correlates they're observing are affecting immunity, just one component of what we consider to be a single aspect of an appropriate immune response in a blood sample. Does my linked article, above and in a different thread, also measure blood sample conditions? Absolutely. But the article I linked directly analyses (spike protein) antibody levels -- an appropriate immune response in a blood sample -- while the articles here examine inferred T cell presence. One is a direct measure of something straightforward, and the other an inferential examination of something complex. [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7885942.1/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7885942.1/

QuadmasterXLII 5y ago

????????

csb6 5y ago

Who said you are going to lose your job? You seem to accept that as a fact, but I’m not sure where you are getting confirmation of this. Are you just assuming that all employers will require you to get a booster shot in the future, even though as of now most employers do not require you to get even a single COVID shot?

silent_cal 5y ago
People are already losing their jobs over these vaccines.
halfjoking 5y ago
My employer has a mandate so it looks like I'm going to be fired in October. I didn't take the vaccine and won't be taking it.
- IAmGraydon 5y ago
  I really cannot overstate how stupid it would be to lose your job over this. What, exactly, do you think the vaccine is going to do to you?