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Mastodon now a non-profit organisation
- nsizx 5y agoFunny that someone would take an alternative to Twitter and incorporate it in the western country that restricts speech the most.
- smhost 5y agoWhy is that funny? It's supposed to be a substitute, not something entirely different altogether.
- D9t7r5wLZD9dYc 5y agoExactly, there are many examples of people in Germany being arrested at gun point for opening their mouth and speaking. Dumb move. USA and Japan are the only logical options for this entity setup.
- qmmmur 5y agoRestricted the most? What?
- zo1 5y agoNot OP. It's kinda hard to find examples at this point, and I don't feel too inclined to trawl through pages and pages of google results before finding what appears to be SEO-demoted results. Some examples I did find: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/20/world/europe/germany-36-accused-of-hateful-postings-over-social-media.html https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/20/world/europe/germany-36-a... And some other relevant links from Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Germany
- qmmmur 5y agoDo you like hate speech or something?
- mattlutze 5y agoIn practice the content that can be challenged under NetzDG is scoped and focused on hate speech and terrorism. While news outlets originally latched onto the "they crush free speech" soundbite, it's really a law to acknowledge the responsibility of the publishing platform for what they're bringing to the world.
- D9t7r5wLZD9dYc 5y agotranslation: You agree there is no freedom of speech in Germany.
- nsizx 5y agoHate speech is free speech.
- detaro 5y agoWhat gives you the impression that "maximized free speech" is the goal of Mastodon?
- Vinnl 5y agoAnd as a hint about whether that is a goal, take a look at Mastodon's instance picker [1], which says: > We only list communities that are committed to active moderation against racism, sexism and transphobia. [1] https://joinmastodon.org/communities https://joinmastodon.org/communities
- asutekku 5y agoThat’s just basic human decency right there.
- user-the-name 5y agoYou will find that a lot of people crying about free speech do not place much value on basic human decency.
- legostormtroopr 5y agoThis is a really bad faith comment
- user-the-name 5y agoWhy? "Active moderation against racism, sexism and transphobia" is, indeed, just basic human decency. And people keep saying, over and over and over, that doing this is against "freedom of speech".
- nsizx 5y agoIt is, actually. Once you restrict what others can say there's no freedom of speech anymore. It's like China saying you can't talk about the regime - I'm sure they consider that "basic human decency" as well.
- input_sh 5y agoThat's pretty cool (and also pretty ridiculous that it took 8 months). I'm kinda confused by the last part: > Since both Patreon and our custom sponsorship platform are based around rewards to patrons/sponsors, they cannot be classified as donations, so there are no changes to how those are taxed. So when German non-profits want to hand out merch in exchange for a specific donation amount, non-profit has to pay for-profit taxes on that?
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- codesections 5y ago> So when German non-profits want to hand out merch in exchange for a specific donation amount, non-profit has to pay for-profit taxes on that? No, I think what he's saying is that it's not a tax-deductible donation for the patrons. (Which is actually more-or-less law in the US too, unless the reward is worth vastly less than the donation[0]) [0] https://www.nolo.com/legal-update/irs-changes-thank-you-gift-rules-35445.html https://www.nolo.com/legal-update/irs-changes-thank-you-gift...
- southerntofu 5y ago> So when German non-profits want to hand out merch in exchange for a specific donation amount, non-profit has to pay for-profit taxes on that? I don't know about german regulations specifically, but based on my experience in other legal systems and my understanding of the announcement, i believe it means that because "patreon and our custom sponsorship platform" aim to reward individuals, they cannot be considered donations for the non-profit. A non-profit may employ/contract people for specific tasks aligned with its goals, but rewarding people outside of such specific contract is closer to a "shareholder" model and incompatible with non-profit regulations. Of course, contributors to a non-profit may setup donation systems to pay their own bills, but that must not be advertised as donations "to the non-profit" (because that would be a lie), and they have to declare/pay taxes on that.
- TeMPOraL 5y agoThat would be my default assumption. Back when I was running a non-profit in Poland, this was the assumption we've made when evaluating options like Patreon - that we'll account for it as income (I don't know the actual interpretation because I've stepped down before the foundation started using such services). On a related note - also in terms of Polish tax laws (which are bound to be more similar to German than e.g. US would be) - I recently talked about this with a tax advisor, in context of individuals funding OSS work via Patreon and other donation schemes; their answer was that it's a bit case-by-case, depending on your reward structure. If the donors are getting direct value back for their donations, it'll be seen as you selling those rewards (and/or performing a service), which will obligate you to start an actual business. The safe way to do it is to not give anything in return, except maybe for a trinket that's not commensurate to the value of donation.
- codesections 5y ago> I want Mastodon to have more resources for things like hiring extra developers, UX designers, developing official apps and so on, and I want there to be a clear boundary between fundraising for that cause and my personal income. This is an important step, and one that I'd love to see more FOSS projects take
- edoceo 5y agoIn USA it's pretty difficult to get a NFP (501c3) created around just code. One needs to have other things in place, community, grand goals, etc. I wish it was easier too but US-IRS has put additional scrutiny. If any lawyers on here have a speciality on this I'm looking for help.
- codesections 5y ago> In USA it's pretty difficult to get a NFP (501c3) created around just code. Yeah, I know, and that does suck. It's varied a bit over time with various IRS administrations, though, so maybe it'll get better. (I am a lawyer, but I don't have an active practice since I became a programmer, so I'm not someone who can help. But good luck!)
- aendruk 5y agoSoftware Freedom Conservancy is a 501(c)(3) not-for-profit organization that […] provides a non-profit home and infrastructure for FLOSS projects. https://sfconservancy.org/ https://sfconservancy.org/
- southerntofu 5y agoRelated discussion: there was recently some move within the community to try and topple the current maintainer. That calls was based on technical/UX disagreements (regarding the local timeline) and on the maintainer allegedly having connection to a surveillance project called Eunomia: https://seedy.xyz/posts/0005-open-letter/ https://seedy.xyz/posts/0005-open-letter/ I am not a member of the Mastodon community and i have no clue to the veracity of these statements, but i believe they're worth considering in the topic of Mastodon changing governance model.
- user-the-name 5y agoComplete and utter conspiracy theorist bullshit, basically.
- southerntofu 5y agoDo you care to elaborate for those people like me who don't have detailed knowledge of the Eunomia project? The official project page features wording that may lead a privacy-conscious person to raise eyebrows: https://cordis.europa.eu/project/id/825171 https://cordis.europa.eu/project/id/825171
- user-the-name 5y agoI can not see a single thing on there that would raise any eyebrows.
- southerntofu 5y ago> determine whether information they come across online is trustworthy or not Who gets to determine what is trustworthy or not? Is it a central authority, or a WoT? The former is a very dangerous tool of social control, the latter does not usually address concerns of misinformation, as the WoT forms information bubbles with their confirmation biases. > the project will allow users to vote on content trustworthiness. The number of votes appears as an indicator that may assist others in assessing trustworthiness How are these votes stored? Are they part of the ActivityPub protocol, or a third-party centralized layer, or some kind of blockchain/DHT? Do you get to see the votes of your contacts, or the overall votes? How do you prevent misinformation campaign to try and hijack the votes? If they are stored in a WoT/blockchain, what kind of measures can you take to protect the social graph? More from the website: > a unique peer-to-peer and blockchain infrastructure > EUNOMIA users can see the modifications of online information in between different users' posts, in an information cascade > This may include indicators of bot activity, such as the ratio of followers to following I don't know about you, but these sentences make me raise eyebrows.
- lvxferre 5y agoFor those who don't know: Mastodon is like Twitter, except decentralised and open source. Becoming a gGmbH means Eugen is seeking to expand it further.
- streamofdigits 5y agoI wonder if all the hoopla is because mastodon / the fediverse are finally receiving some (deserved) traction? The accounts count does not seem to show a new regime (https://the-federation.info/ https://the-federation.info/) but maybe there are more reliable indicators? In any case, sorting out conflicts of interest, business models, competing visions etc about the fediverse is a task that is still almost 100% for the future, as being niche and unknown does not put much pressure. The issue of a "local or global timeline" is imho but the thin edge of a wedge: the current open source fediverse projects largely emulate the surveillance platforms (indiscriminately copying the good and the bad). That is extremely limiting and ultimately self-defeating. The open source fediverse can, must (and most likely in due course will) redefine the meaning of social platforms so as to undo the damage done by the first generations. Godspeed
- indigochill 5y agoIsn't (one of) the point of federation to limit the scope of surveillance? e.g. My host knows everything about me, but hosts it peers with only know that I'm indigochill@myhost, essentially the same as email.
- streamofdigits 5y agothere are so many configurations with different "information leakage" profiles / preferences: from self-hosting to mass instances, from pseudonymous accounts to verified / public identities etc. One of the strong points of the fediverse would be to enable and organize that multitude of options under uniform protocols that do not force anybody to particular architectures...
- riffic 5y agoquick, give me an accurate count of the number of email addresses provisioned worldwide. You'll never be able to accurately measure the federated social web unfortunately, just due to how it works (and how statistics can be inflated).
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- fortyrod 5y agoThis title needs to be disambiguated. I had assumed that most musicians, and especially prog metal bands, were non-profit by default. I was curious why that had to be made explicit!
- proactivesvcs 5y agoGlad to see this important step in securing the future of software that is more than just code. Having been a member of the Fosstodon instance https://www.fosstodon.org/ https://www.fosstodon.org/ for six months I expect that many HNers may find it an interesting and engaging instance. It's centred around free/open source software and similar services and is fully of friendly, witty and knowledgeable folk.
- bovermyer 5y agoI applied to join Fosstodon based on your comment.
- icy 5y agoFosstodon, despite the name, is run by people who don't actually use free software. It's pretty funny.
- proactivesvcs 5y agoYou'll also find that users of the instance don't all run entirely free software and yet it's still a relevant place to congregate and discuss topics like "why this open source project didn't work for me", "why this open source project was a great alternative to closed-source offerings" and all of the subtleties in-between. My experience of most of these conversations is that few people try to gatekeep or provide vapid criticism of people who aren't fanatical purists.
- coopermatt137 5y agoYou'll find that most community members (including the staff) come from a wide/diverse background. Unlike some other groups that have more of a "FOSS or else" atmosphere, Fosstodon has members (and staff) that are hobbyists to extremists to pragmatics and everything in between. It's really a great place to discuss and support the FOSS movement without being chastised if you're not "all in".
- wintermutestwin 5y agoThis is the way we defeat stalker capitalists who are trading trinkets to the natives for land. The core functionality of FaceCrook, Twatter and Instaglam doesn't require $billions. The data we pay for these services is worth so much more that the exchange is essentially theft. I have no use for a Twatter replacement, but when a non-profit (or benefit corporation) starts up a viable FaceCrook replacement, I will gladly donate.
- the_jeremy 5y agoFacebook makes ~$20 off your data each year (https://www.thegoodestate.com/facebook-arpu/ https://www.thegoodestate.com/facebook-arpu/). You might believe your data is worth more than that, but no one is willing to pay more for it. Regardless, name calling will not engender support for your position, even for people who already have similar ideals.
- wintermutestwin 5y ago1. In a capitalist society, I should be able to name the price for something that belongs to me. 2. FaceCrook still has my data after they sell it. Part of their valuation is based on the future value of all the data they have accumulated. >name calling will not engender support for your position I find that humor is an effective counter to power. These corporations that are selling the masses trinkets for something of true value while wasting the talents of our "best and brightest" on stalkertech deserve ridicule. Why should I afford these petty crooks any respect?
- svrourke 5y ago1. In a capitalist society price is dictated by supply/demand I would expect Facebook's valuation is less about knowing you like dogs and more on the fact that their advertising system allows people to show dog teeshirts directly to people who like dogs I'm surprised the average user's data is worth even $20/year
- wintermutestwin 5y ago
- p4bl0 5y agoI really wonder how Bluesky [1] (Twitter's project of project to build a decentralized social media protocol) will take ActivityPub and especially Mastodon into account… Both the W3C and RetroShare have reacted to the news on Twitter [2] but are totally ignored so far. [1] https://blueskyweb.org/ https://blueskyweb.org/ [2] https://twitter.com/jack/status/1204766078468911106 https://twitter.com/jack/status/1204766078468911106
- crossroadsguy 5y agoA wild guess would be that he is trying to remake a centralised decentralised Twitter. I think he just wants to keep one hand in somewhere that can be spun as something else when Twitter will start being unbearable if it hasn’t already. Something like the Banks first dissing crypto and now lining up to make “their own crypto”. I mean who knows. But he not even acknowledging ActivityPub in any of those N insipid tweets, even after being reminded by others, says volumes about his intentions.
- riffic 5y agoUntil someone from the Bluesky leadership team officially stands up their own AP-speaking site, I wouldn't expect them to commit to anything. On the other hand, they've been quick to build a community around a proprietary/closed/centralized service (Discord). Bare minimum would be to stand up a WP site with the ActivityPub Plugin for feeding back their statuses to the existing standards-based social web.
- oytis 5y agoIs it really complete list of communities available through Mastodon or is there more? Looks pretty tiny so far.
- proactivesvcs 5y agoThere's also https://instances.social/ https://instances.social/ and https://fediverse.party/en/mastodon https://fediverse.party/en/mastodon
- andrewmcwatters 5y agoMastodon is an ActivityPub implementation, right? So does that mean Mastodon can interact with other AP implementations? Or do they add some additional stuff that doesn’t interop?
- okennedy 5y agoIt can and does. e.g., a Mastodon account can subscribe to one on PeerTube.
- proactivesvcs 5y agoYes. I subscribe to a few write.as blogs and Pixelfed accounts from my Mastodon account.
- Grustaf 5y agoI suppose it’s a moot point?