5 ms·

Nah... probably large portion of this was paid to US corporations and citizens. Spending on the level of government is counterintuitive. If you are government

Nah... probably large portion of this was paid to US corporations and citizens. Spending on the level of government is counterintuitive. If you are government you hand out money but it gets back to you. Unfortunately, interest on that debt is real and is owed to other countries.

mulmen 5y ago
How is it owed to other countries?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- lmilcin 5y ago
  You borrow money, they want it back with interest. Have you ever borrowed money from mommy for lollipops? She probably didn't want it back, but other countries are not so nice.
  - mulmen 5y ago
    I interpreted your comment as claiming all government debt is foreign, which seems surprising. Is domestic debt not a thing?
- slacktide 5y ago
  Because they are the ones who lent the US the money. China is the #2 holder of US treasury bonds and currently own about 1T worth. (4% of the US national debt) Japan is the #1 holder at 1.2T. Source: https://ticdata.treasury.gov/Publish/mfh.txt https://ticdata.treasury.gov/Publish/mfh.txt
  - SubiculumCode 5y ago
    No one "lent" us money. It's a fiat currency with a self-imposed limit on new money creation.
    - lmilcin 5y ago
      > No one "lent" us money. Obviously you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. BOND. Issued by US government. Is a promise that US will pay back the price of the bond at some predetermined future date and in the meantime it will also be paying interest in regular installments. Others (including other countries) buy US bonds, which finances US spending. You know, whenever there is this big debate about whether to close US government or not? So it is kinda stupid to say "no one lent us money", because, you know, they did.
      - SubiculumCode 5y ago
        Wow, you are a dick.
        lmilcin 5y ago
        At least I am competent dick. I work with financial instruments and risk for largest banks in the world. I am competent to point out you have no idea when you say nobody lends US money because I am calculating risk of that debt as my day job. I am not allowed tell you how much but surprisingly large portion of it.
        SubiculumCode 5y ago
        See and respond to my other post. It seems reasonable to assume that most of the money that was lent to us via the BOND/Treasury ultimately came from fiat money creation via the banks through the fractional reserve system.
        dang 5y ago
        Please do not respond to a bad comment by breaking the site guidelines yourself. It only makes things worse. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
        SubiculumCode 5y ago
antattack 5y ago
Wrong US companies got the money, like BlackRock that owns 9trillion dollars in US assets, invests in weapons, including cluster munitions [2] and are untouchable[1]: [1]https://www.warren.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/warren-to-yellen-at-hearing-how-will-you-evaluate-and-manage-risks-posed-by-blackrock-and-other-financial-giants https://www.warren.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/warren... [2]https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/analysis-and-features/cluster-munitions-ethical-investing-blackrock-state-street-vanguard-a9529031.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/analysis-and-fea...
- lmilcin 5y ago
  Well, 34th Rule of Acquisition clearly states, "War is good for business". EDIT: I don't like when the parent removes his entire comment and replaces it with something else, so now your comment seems stupid and off topic. I leave mine because I like DS9
  - octodog 5y ago
    True enough. But don't forget the 35th Rule of Acquisition - "Peace is good for business".
    - lmilcin 5y ago
      I set it up for this comment:) Thanks.
nabla9 5y ago
> Unfortunately, interest on that debt is real and is owed to other countries. Most of that debt is internal. Highlights from the March 2021 report * Federal Reserve and government: $10.81 trillion (December 2020) * Foreign: $7.07 trillion (in September 2020, Japan owned $1.28 trillion and China owned $1.06 trillion of U.S. debt, which is more than a third of foreign holdings) * Mutual funds: $3.5 trillion * Other holders, including individuals, government-sponsored enterprises, brokers and dealers, banks, bank personal trusts and estates, corporate and non-corporate businesses, and other investors: $2.28 trillion * State and local governments, including their pension funds: $1.09 trillion * Private pension funds: $784 billion * Insurance companies: $253 billion * U.S. savings bonds: $147 billion (December 2020) source: https://www.thebalance.com/who-owns-the-u-s-national-debt-3306124 https://www.thebalance.com/who-owns-the-u-s-national-debt-33...
- lmilcin 5y ago
  That's 7 trillion dollars owed to other countries (about 1/3rd of all debt, by the looks of it). Nothing to sneeze at.
mellow-lake-day 5y ago
Funneling money from US taxpayers to US corporations at unprecedented speeds I would say that the fabricated wars started by Bush/Cheney have been very successful and had great return on investment
hack-news 5y ago
You need to stop and evaluate what brought you to the point of believing something so retarded. It matters what we spend money on. It matters what we do. The mere act of "doing" something is neutral and it's embarrassing that you need this explained to you.

mulmen 5y ago

How is it owed to other countries?

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
lmilcin 5y ago
You borrow money, they want it back with interest. Have you ever borrowed money from mommy for lollipops? She probably didn't want it back, but other countries are not so nice.
- mulmen 5y ago
  I interpreted your comment as claiming all government debt is foreign, which seems surprising. Is domestic debt not a thing?
slacktide 5y ago
Because they are the ones who lent the US the money. China is the #2 holder of US treasury bonds and currently own about 1T worth. (4% of the US national debt) Japan is the #1 holder at 1.2T. Source: https://ticdata.treasury.gov/Publish/mfh.txt https://ticdata.treasury.gov/Publish/mfh.txt
- SubiculumCode 5y ago
  No one "lent" us money. It's a fiat currency with a self-imposed limit on new money creation.
  - lmilcin 5y ago
    > No one "lent" us money. Obviously you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. BOND. Issued by US government. Is a promise that US will pay back the price of the bond at some predetermined future date and in the meantime it will also be paying interest in regular installments. Others (including other countries) buy US bonds, which finances US spending. You know, whenever there is this big debate about whether to close US government or not? So it is kinda stupid to say "no one lent us money", because, you know, they did.
    - SubiculumCode 5y ago
      Wow, you are a dick.
      - lmilcin 5y ago
        At least I am competent dick. I work with financial instruments and risk for largest banks in the world. I am competent to point out you have no idea when you say nobody lends US money because I am calculating risk of that debt as my day job. I am not allowed tell you how much but surprisingly large portion of it.
        SubiculumCode 5y ago
        See and respond to my other post. It seems reasonable to assume that most of the money that was lent to us via the BOND/Treasury ultimately came from fiat money creation via the banks through the fractional reserve system.
      - dang 5y ago
        Please do not respond to a bad comment by breaking the site guidelines yourself. It only makes things worse. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
        SubiculumCode 5y ago

antattack 5y ago

Wrong US companies got the money, like BlackRock that owns 9trillion dollars in US assets, invests in weapons, including cluster munitions [2] and are untouchable[1]: [1]https://www.warren.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/warren-to-yellen-at-hearing-how-will-you-evaluate-and-manage-risks-posed-by-blackrock-and-other-financial-giants https://www.warren.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/warren... [2]https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/analysis-and-features/cluster-munitions-ethical-investing-blackrock-state-street-vanguard-a9529031.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/analysis-and-fea...

lmilcin 5y ago
Well, 34th Rule of Acquisition clearly states, "War is good for business". EDIT: I don't like when the parent removes his entire comment and replaces it with something else, so now your comment seems stupid and off topic. I leave mine because I like DS9
- octodog 5y ago
  True enough. But don't forget the 35th Rule of Acquisition - "Peace is good for business".
  - lmilcin 5y ago
    I set it up for this comment:) Thanks.

nabla9 5y ago

> Unfortunately, interest on that debt is real and is owed to other countries. Most of that debt is internal. Highlights from the March 2021 report * Federal Reserve and government: $10.81 trillion (December 2020) * Foreign: $7.07 trillion (in September 2020, Japan owned $1.28 trillion and China owned $1.06 trillion of U.S. debt, which is more than a third of foreign holdings) * Mutual funds: $3.5 trillion * Other holders, including individuals, government-sponsored enterprises, brokers and dealers, banks, bank personal trusts and estates, corporate and non-corporate businesses, and other investors: $2.28 trillion * State and local governments, including their pension funds: $1.09 trillion * Private pension funds: $784 billion * Insurance companies: $253 billion * U.S. savings bonds: $147 billion (December 2020) source: https://www.thebalance.com/who-owns-the-u-s-national-debt-3306124 https://www.thebalance.com/who-owns-the-u-s-national-debt-33...

lmilcin 5y ago
That's 7 trillion dollars owed to other countries (about 1/3rd of all debt, by the looks of it). Nothing to sneeze at.

mellow-lake-day 5y ago

Funneling money from US taxpayers to US corporations at unprecedented speeds I would say that the fabricated wars started by Bush/Cheney have been very successful and had great return on investment

hack-news 5y ago

You need to stop and evaluate what brought you to the point of believing something so retarded. It matters what we spend money on. It matters what we do. The mere act of "doing" something is neutral and it's embarrassing that you need this explained to you.