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This is bizarre but, I at least, in the UK wouldn't consider 'Ford' an American brand as we often get quite different Ford's to the ones sold in the US (Even wh

This is bizarre but, I at least, in the UK wouldn't consider 'Ford' an American brand as we often get quite different Ford's to the ones sold in the US (Even when the name is the same, they often look totally different like the Focus). I know that's wrong, but its just the way it is. (Although Mustang is the exception to that). I feel like when most people think of American Cars they think of big GM's, etc and at least in the UK they are not really are really famed for comfort, instead they were always famed for handling badly and having terrible MPG. Now don't get me wrong, I know the US has some great cars, but I think the markets are very different and the ones that have been available to us have been awful, expensive, or both. My point is, I don't think people are buying the Mach-E cause its an opportunity to try the 'famed American Comfort Car' but more because its a good option for an electric car, and that's what a lot of people in Europe want when buying brand new cars now.

jorvi 5y ago
When I think modern American cars I think either trucks like a Ford F-150 / Dodge Ram, or a gas-guzzling gigantic SUV like a GMC Yukon.
- jorvi 5y ago
  Since I can't edit anymore: normally I prefer not to talk about downvotes, but wow, -3 for stating an opinion, what the hell. I guess Americans are extremely sensitive about how they are perceived..
fhood 5y ago
Oof, GM sucks and Ford isn't really even American. Talk about a one two punch. Not that I disagree with the main point, but jeez leave us with something wouldya?
- dragontamer 5y ago
  As an American, I recognize that the Ford cars popular across the pond are a very, very different set of vehicles than the Ford trucks popular around here. The Ford Focus (including the RS version) is popular in Europe. However, as an owner of such a car, I only get raised eyebrows around here. In contrast, F150 / Trucks / etc. etc. are "real Ford Cars". No one trusts Ford Sedans over here for some reason, despite their popularity in Europe (which is why Ford stopped selling Sedans in the USA, and are instead opting for a $20k truck: the Maverick, over continuing their efficient line of sedans)
  - bsanr2 5y ago
    >No one trusts Ford Sedans over here for some reason From my personal observation: poor maintenance and safety ratings compared to alts. Driving is dangerous in America and you have to have a car to participate economically in most of the country. Also, the used market here is huge and not a lot of 90s/2000s Ford sedans made it this far. Anyone who knows better, feel free to correct.
    - dragontamer 5y ago
      > poor maintenance and safety ratings compared to alts Ford Focus beat the pants off of Honda Fit, roughly in the same category of weight (though the Honda Fit is quite a bit cheaper MSRP, the Ford Focus was frequently on sale at quite low prices). But people _believe_ the Honda Fit has superior maintenance and safety ratings. So that's that. Reputation is more important than facts.
      - bsanr2 5y ago
        What? The Focus is a compact car and competes with the Civic. They've traded rankings over the years, but the Focus isn't a clear winner. The Fit is in a different class (a subcompact that competed with the Ford Fiesta), and in any case, I was thinking of the Corolla - which is far-and-away better-rated - and of larger sedans.
  - foobarian 5y ago
    I don't think the problem with sedans was trust, so much as they were being outsold by SUVs and crossovers to the point it didn't make sense for Ford to keep making them. I'm still upset they cut the Focus/Fiesta ST models. You will have to pry mine from my cold dead fingers :-)
  - rootusrootus 5y ago
    > which is why Ford stopped selling Sedans in the USA More accurately, sedans from any manufacturer have been in steady decline for years. So only the biggest names are still selling enough to justify continued development. Everyone else is switching to CUVs because that's what customers want today. Can't blame them, typical CUVs now have basically the same fuel efficiency as a sedan but a little more utility and a bit easier to live with (slide in/out without up/down).
- TMWNN 5y ago
  Milner08's comment isn't saying that Ford isn't an American company. It's saying that in Britain, Ford was so accepted for so long that it became "one of our own". That's a compliment. See my other comment.
jimbob21 5y ago
>I feel like when most people think of American Cars they think of big GM's This might be more correct if you specify the UK has this opinion, because it definitely isn't a generally held opinion elsewhere. Everyone in the US definitely thinks of Ford as a quintessential American car company. The F-150 is the most popular truck in the US, and used to be the most popular vehicle of any type sold.
cptskippy 5y ago
> like the Focus In the US, the Focus isn't held in high regard. It's a lower class commuter car or a middle class teenager starter car. They have poor quality finishes and cosmetically look like ass after a year or two. That's generally how most American cars are, they look all shiny and new the first year but the finish is superficial and wears off quickly. This is especially true of vehicles that win JD Power's "Highest in initial quality" awards.
- xeromal 5y ago
  Yup, what people think of as high quality and rugged American "cars" would be the truck. Used widely across the states, durable, functional, and built in the US for the most part.
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  The fit and finish on these cars is fine. Their cost of ownership is fine. The true difference between brands is very, very small. That said, the internet fanboy talking points you're parroting are exactly why your first sentence is spot on. The new car market is chock full of feedback loops that make perception more important than strict "by the numbers" reality.
  - cptskippy 5y ago
    Your comment is an interesting, you've correctly identified the phenomenon at play but misattributed. > The new car market is chock full of feedback loops that make perception more important than strict "by the numbers" reality. I can only assume you put "by the numbers" in quotes because you're referring to something other than actual numbers and statistics. When you look at something like the Consumer Reports Reliability Index for the last 30 years you will find the 3 most unreliable brands are the big 3 US automakers. If you look at CR's used cars to avoid list, guess who dominates? The same 3. Most people don't have access to CR but there are plenty of sites that make their info available. This one is a little dated but it does a good job showing historical data: http://autooninfo.net/ http://autooninfo.net/
    - 5y ago
kbenson 5y ago
> I at least, in the UK wouldn't consider 'Ford' an American brand as we often get quite different Ford's to the ones sold in the US (Even when the name is the same, they often look totally different like the Focus). Are you sure that's not old info? I know there used to be major differences (which was obvious if you watched World Rally back in the day, since you couldn't get one of those Ford Focus models in the US), but I had heard they were consolidating some, so looked it up. According to Wikipedia[1], about a decade ago Ford started consolidating it's US and UK models, and now I think maybe beyond a couple variations only being available in one are, they are mostly the same. (It also notes they closed 3 of their factories in Europe). For the Focus specifically, they unified the models in 2011[2]. That said, even if Ford is or was building European specific versions in Europe, I wouldn't consider that any more a UK car company and less a US car company that I would consider Honda and Toyota any less Japanese car companies and more US even through they have many plants in the US and significant portions of their cars and materials are built here to get around import tariffs. They have significant portions of their companies housed here, and US divisions doing R&D in some cases, but those are definitely Japanese companies. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_of_Europe#2011%E2%80%93present:_One_Ford https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_of_Europe#2011%E2%80%93pr... 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Focus#Third_generation_(C346;_2011) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Focus#Third_generation_(C...
- Brakenshire 5y ago
  Many of the smaller Ford cars seem to be designed by the European subsidiary and then either exclusively sold in Europe or later sold in America, for instance the Kuga which is now being sold as the Escape in the USA. Ford obviously aspired to unify across the two markets, but the differences between them are so large it doesn’t seem practical for most of their range. Ford in the USA seems to make most of their money from pickup trucks, with the Mustang brand as a significant extra, and both of those are negligible here. And now there’s enormous pressure from the European efficiency standards, so that Ford is licensing some EVs from VW. I wouldn’t be surprised if the European division was sold off like GM with Opel.
  - kbenson 5y ago
fergie 5y ago
Its hard to explain, but "AmCar" is a sort of cultural identity think for many rural Norwegians. I agree with the point about "British Ford”. Capris, Escorts and Sierras are quintessentially British cars, especially the ones with the Cosworth engines.
ilamont 5y ago
Even when the name is the same, they often look totally different like the Focus When I lived in the UK in the 90s I was surprised to see "Ford Granada" meant a modest four-door passenger car not unlike a Camry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(Europe)#/media/File:Ford_Granada_MkII_pre_facelift_ca_1980.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(Europe)#/media/F...) compared to the hulking, chrome-fronted US beast I drove in high school (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(North_America)#/media/File:Ford_Granada_(North-America).jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(North_America)#/...)
- tonyedgecombe 5y ago
  The Ford Granada was a comparatively large car. At one company I worked for the engineers drove Escorts, the salesmen (it was all men) drove Cortinas and the managers drove Granadas.
TMWNN 5y ago
>This is bizarre but, I at least, in the UK wouldn't consider 'Ford' an American brand I think a lot of people are missing what you mean by the above. Ford has been in Britain and Ireland for a century. Multiple generations have driven Fords and have worked at the Dagenham plant and at the former Cork plant, built aircraft engines during WW2 there. Ford's raises were used to determine raises for other industries (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent#Ford_negotiations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent#Ford_nego...>); that's how much Ford was seen as a "native" company. The 2010 film Made in Dagenham (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Made_in_Dagenham https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Made_in_Dagenham>), about a notable strike in British labor history, is called that because it occurred at the Ford plant.
fy20 5y ago
The engines are also completely different in the US vs Europe. Ford diesel engines in Europe are made by Stellantis/PSA. The engine in a Ford Fiesta is also used in cars by Peugeot, Citroen, DS, Opel/Vauxhall and Toyota. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_DLD_engine#DLD-415 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_DLD_engine#DLD-415

jorvi 5y ago

When I think modern American cars I think either trucks like a Ford F-150 / Dodge Ram, or a gas-guzzling gigantic SUV like a GMC Yukon.

jorvi 5y ago
Since I can't edit anymore: normally I prefer not to talk about downvotes, but wow, -3 for stating an opinion, what the hell. I guess Americans are extremely sensitive about how they are perceived..

fhood 5y ago

Oof, GM sucks and Ford isn't really even American. Talk about a one two punch. Not that I disagree with the main point, but jeez leave us with something wouldya?

dragontamer 5y ago
As an American, I recognize that the Ford cars popular across the pond are a very, very different set of vehicles than the Ford trucks popular around here. The Ford Focus (including the RS version) is popular in Europe. However, as an owner of such a car, I only get raised eyebrows around here. In contrast, F150 / Trucks / etc. etc. are "real Ford Cars". No one trusts Ford Sedans over here for some reason, despite their popularity in Europe (which is why Ford stopped selling Sedans in the USA, and are instead opting for a $20k truck: the Maverick, over continuing their efficient line of sedans)
- bsanr2 5y ago
  >No one trusts Ford Sedans over here for some reason From my personal observation: poor maintenance and safety ratings compared to alts. Driving is dangerous in America and you have to have a car to participate economically in most of the country. Also, the used market here is huge and not a lot of 90s/2000s Ford sedans made it this far. Anyone who knows better, feel free to correct.
  - dragontamer 5y ago
    > poor maintenance and safety ratings compared to alts Ford Focus beat the pants off of Honda Fit, roughly in the same category of weight (though the Honda Fit is quite a bit cheaper MSRP, the Ford Focus was frequently on sale at quite low prices). But people _believe_ the Honda Fit has superior maintenance and safety ratings. So that's that. Reputation is more important than facts.
    - bsanr2 5y ago
      What? The Focus is a compact car and competes with the Civic. They've traded rankings over the years, but the Focus isn't a clear winner. The Fit is in a different class (a subcompact that competed with the Ford Fiesta), and in any case, I was thinking of the Corolla - which is far-and-away better-rated - and of larger sedans.
- foobarian 5y ago
  I don't think the problem with sedans was trust, so much as they were being outsold by SUVs and crossovers to the point it didn't make sense for Ford to keep making them. I'm still upset they cut the Focus/Fiesta ST models. You will have to pry mine from my cold dead fingers :-)
- rootusrootus 5y ago
  > which is why Ford stopped selling Sedans in the USA More accurately, sedans from any manufacturer have been in steady decline for years. So only the biggest names are still selling enough to justify continued development. Everyone else is switching to CUVs because that's what customers want today. Can't blame them, typical CUVs now have basically the same fuel efficiency as a sedan but a little more utility and a bit easier to live with (slide in/out without up/down).
TMWNN 5y ago
Milner08's comment isn't saying that Ford isn't an American company. It's saying that in Britain, Ford was so accepted for so long that it became "one of our own". That's a compliment. See my other comment.

jimbob21 5y ago

>I feel like when most people think of American Cars they think of big GM's This might be more correct if you specify the UK has this opinion, because it definitely isn't a generally held opinion elsewhere. Everyone in the US definitely thinks of Ford as a quintessential American car company. The F-150 is the most popular truck in the US, and used to be the most popular vehicle of any type sold.

cptskippy 5y ago

> like the Focus In the US, the Focus isn't held in high regard. It's a lower class commuter car or a middle class teenager starter car. They have poor quality finishes and cosmetically look like ass after a year or two. That's generally how most American cars are, they look all shiny and new the first year but the finish is superficial and wears off quickly. This is especially true of vehicles that win JD Power's "Highest in initial quality" awards.

xeromal 5y ago
Yup, what people think of as high quality and rugged American "cars" would be the truck. Used widely across the states, durable, functional, and built in the US for the most part.
throwaway0a5e 5y ago
The fit and finish on these cars is fine. Their cost of ownership is fine. The true difference between brands is very, very small. That said, the internet fanboy talking points you're parroting are exactly why your first sentence is spot on. The new car market is chock full of feedback loops that make perception more important than strict "by the numbers" reality.
- cptskippy 5y ago
  Your comment is an interesting, you've correctly identified the phenomenon at play but misattributed. > The new car market is chock full of feedback loops that make perception more important than strict "by the numbers" reality. I can only assume you put "by the numbers" in quotes because you're referring to something other than actual numbers and statistics. When you look at something like the Consumer Reports Reliability Index for the last 30 years you will find the 3 most unreliable brands are the big 3 US automakers. If you look at CR's used cars to avoid list, guess who dominates? The same 3. Most people don't have access to CR but there are plenty of sites that make their info available. This one is a little dated but it does a good job showing historical data: http://autooninfo.net/ http://autooninfo.net/
  - 5y ago

kbenson 5y ago

> I at least, in the UK wouldn't consider 'Ford' an American brand as we often get quite different Ford's to the ones sold in the US (Even when the name is the same, they often look totally different like the Focus). Are you sure that's not old info? I know there used to be major differences (which was obvious if you watched World Rally back in the day, since you couldn't get one of those Ford Focus models in the US), but I had heard they were consolidating some, so looked it up. According to Wikipedia[1], about a decade ago Ford started consolidating it's US and UK models, and now I think maybe beyond a couple variations only being available in one are, they are mostly the same. (It also notes they closed 3 of their factories in Europe). For the Focus specifically, they unified the models in 2011[2]. That said, even if Ford is or was building European specific versions in Europe, I wouldn't consider that any more a UK car company and less a US car company that I would consider Honda and Toyota any less Japanese car companies and more US even through they have many plants in the US and significant portions of their cars and materials are built here to get around import tariffs. They have significant portions of their companies housed here, and US divisions doing R&D in some cases, but those are definitely Japanese companies. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_of_Europe#2011%E2%80%93present:_One_Ford https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_of_Europe#2011%E2%80%93pr... 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Focus#Third_generation_(C346;_2011) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Focus#Third_generation_(C...

Brakenshire 5y ago
Many of the smaller Ford cars seem to be designed by the European subsidiary and then either exclusively sold in Europe or later sold in America, for instance the Kuga which is now being sold as the Escape in the USA. Ford obviously aspired to unify across the two markets, but the differences between them are so large it doesn’t seem practical for most of their range. Ford in the USA seems to make most of their money from pickup trucks, with the Mustang brand as a significant extra, and both of those are negligible here. And now there’s enormous pressure from the European efficiency standards, so that Ford is licensing some EVs from VW. I wouldn’t be surprised if the European division was sold off like GM with Opel.
- kbenson 5y ago

fergie 5y ago

Its hard to explain, but "AmCar" is a sort of cultural identity think for many rural Norwegians. I agree with the point about "British Ford”. Capris, Escorts and Sierras are quintessentially British cars, especially the ones with the Cosworth engines.

ilamont 5y ago

Even when the name is the same, they often look totally different like the Focus When I lived in the UK in the 90s I was surprised to see "Ford Granada" meant a modest four-door passenger car not unlike a Camry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(Europe)#/media/File:Ford_Granada_MkII_pre_facelift_ca_1980.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(Europe)#/media/F...) compared to the hulking, chrome-fronted US beast I drove in high school (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(North_America)#/media/File:Ford_Granada_(North-America).jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Granada_(North_America)#/...)

tonyedgecombe 5y ago
The Ford Granada was a comparatively large car. At one company I worked for the engineers drove Escorts, the salesmen (it was all men) drove Cortinas and the managers drove Granadas.

TMWNN 5y ago

>This is bizarre but, I at least, in the UK wouldn't consider 'Ford' an American brand I think a lot of people are missing what you mean by the above. Ford has been in Britain and Ireland for a century. Multiple generations have driven Fords and have worked at the Dagenham plant and at the former Cork plant, built aircraft engines during WW2 there. Ford's raises were used to determine raises for other industries (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent#Ford_negotiations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent#Ford_nego...>); that's how much Ford was seen as a "native" company. The 2010 film Made in Dagenham (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Made_in_Dagenham https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Made_in_Dagenham>), about a notable strike in British labor history, is called that because it occurred at the Ford plant.

fy20 5y ago

The engines are also completely different in the US vs Europe. Ford diesel engines in Europe are made by Stellantis/PSA. The engine in a Ford Fiesta is also used in cars by Peugeot, Citroen, DS, Opel/Vauxhall and Toyota. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_DLD_engine#DLD-415 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_DLD_engine#DLD-415