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It took a while, but the legacy automakers are finally putting out some decent EVs. From a quality and performance perspective, they seem to be pretty good, bu

It took a while, but the legacy automakers are finally putting out some decent EVs. From a quality and performance perspective, they seem to be pretty good, but still have a ways to go to match Tesla in the "wow" factor. But, perhaps the similarity with everyday ICE vehicles will be a boon to adoption; older people are reluctant to take on seemingly overwhelming tech...

jclardy 5y ago
With the Mustang and the F-150 Lightning I think Ford is in a pretty good position to become the leader in the EV space. I'm personally waiting for the F-150 as I could use a truck for hauling things to a retail store my wife and I own, but I also don't like ICE truck's just because there is no trunk to keep things like my laptop or simply transporting groceries. The frunk on the lightning is a huge selling point for me, other than not having to go to a gas station since 99% of my trips are in town < 20 miles so I can just charge at home.
- ajross 5y ago
  > With the Mustang and the F-150 Lightning I think Ford is in a pretty good position to become the leader in the EV space. I think a lot of this is the result of some marketing and memery. In fact I went through that process, and decided on a BEV crossover, and the Model Y beats the Mach-E handily on basically every non-subjective metric but price. And it's really not that close. Ford has done a good job of digging themselves out of a huge hole, and have a decently competetive car in the market. And it's selling well enough. But Tesla is moving like an order of magnitude more vehicles into that space, has their factories running at capacity and is in the process of tripling their production bandwidth (Gigafactory Shanghai is still ramping, and Berlin and Austin seem to be on track to go online this year). It's pretty clear who the leader is.
atty 5y ago
Yeah I think a lot of the familiarity is a good thing. I don’t think my dad would ever buy a Tesla, he would be put off by the minimalism and all the controls on the screen (and he wouldn’t even consider a car with a yoke instead of a steering wheel… although to be fair, neither would I). On the other hand, if I get a charger installed in his garage, I think he would be very happy to use a car that works (in terms of user interaction) just like his old one, but where he doesn’t have to go to the gas station and get oil changes.
- NotSammyHagar 5y ago
  The yoke on the new s seems obviously stupid. If I ignore that every anything else seems good. I've got a 7-year-old s and about the only reason for a new car is an extended warranty over mine which ends at 8. If I could buy a warranty for two or three more years I'd probably just keep this car. The rivian looks good.
eptcyka 5y ago
What do you mean by a "wow" factor? Is it like "Wow, look at those panel gaps?"? The best and only redeeming quality Tesla vehicles have is the charging network. Quality-wise, they are overpriced.
- ajross 5y ago
  This is a meme. It's true that back around 2015 or so there were some genuine videos made of people finding big mistakes on their luxury-priced vehicles and laughing about it. But that was years ago. Go check now and see how many horror stories you can find about manufacturing errors on 3's or Y's. These are fine cars. I mean, I'm sure someone can find an error here or there, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with these cars. Tech neighborhoods are increasingly filled with them, just go to a Whole Foods parking lot and look at some. See how many gaps you can find.
  - eptcyka 5y ago
    I'm pretty sure they still can't make a car that doesn't fall apart[1]. [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Pg7JmKElUw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Pg7JmKElUw
    - ajross 5y ago
      Ugh. There are no panel gaps shown in the linked video, nor any manufacturing defects. The complaints are about damage and dirt in a loaner vehicle from a service center. This is what I meant. It's a meme. All you care about is that headline ("Tesla Can't Build Cars") and not the truth about anything.
      - eptcyka 5y ago
        It's not a loaner vehicle, it's the replacement for the one that was totaled. Here's another video of a 2021 model year: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFfgpHkNCOM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFfgpHkNCOM
      - jazzyjackson 5y ago

jclardy 5y ago

With the Mustang and the F-150 Lightning I think Ford is in a pretty good position to become the leader in the EV space. I'm personally waiting for the F-150 as I could use a truck for hauling things to a retail store my wife and I own, but I also don't like ICE truck's just because there is no trunk to keep things like my laptop or simply transporting groceries. The frunk on the lightning is a huge selling point for me, other than not having to go to a gas station since 99% of my trips are in town < 20 miles so I can just charge at home.

ajross 5y ago
> With the Mustang and the F-150 Lightning I think Ford is in a pretty good position to become the leader in the EV space. I think a lot of this is the result of some marketing and memery. In fact I went through that process, and decided on a BEV crossover, and the Model Y beats the Mach-E handily on basically every non-subjective metric but price. And it's really not that close. Ford has done a good job of digging themselves out of a huge hole, and have a decently competetive car in the market. And it's selling well enough. But Tesla is moving like an order of magnitude more vehicles into that space, has their factories running at capacity and is in the process of tripling their production bandwidth (Gigafactory Shanghai is still ramping, and Berlin and Austin seem to be on track to go online this year). It's pretty clear who the leader is.

atty 5y ago

Yeah I think a lot of the familiarity is a good thing. I don’t think my dad would ever buy a Tesla, he would be put off by the minimalism and all the controls on the screen (and he wouldn’t even consider a car with a yoke instead of a steering wheel… although to be fair, neither would I). On the other hand, if I get a charger installed in his garage, I think he would be very happy to use a car that works (in terms of user interaction) just like his old one, but where he doesn’t have to go to the gas station and get oil changes.

NotSammyHagar 5y ago
The yoke on the new s seems obviously stupid. If I ignore that every anything else seems good. I've got a 7-year-old s and about the only reason for a new car is an extended warranty over mine which ends at 8. If I could buy a warranty for two or three more years I'd probably just keep this car. The rivian looks good.

eptcyka 5y ago

What do you mean by a "wow" factor? Is it like "Wow, look at those panel gaps?"? The best and only redeeming quality Tesla vehicles have is the charging network. Quality-wise, they are overpriced.

ajross 5y ago
This is a meme. It's true that back around 2015 or so there were some genuine videos made of people finding big mistakes on their luxury-priced vehicles and laughing about it. But that was years ago. Go check now and see how many horror stories you can find about manufacturing errors on 3's or Y's. These are fine cars. I mean, I'm sure someone can find an error here or there, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with these cars. Tech neighborhoods are increasingly filled with them, just go to a Whole Foods parking lot and look at some. See how many gaps you can find.
- eptcyka 5y ago
  I'm pretty sure they still can't make a car that doesn't fall apart[1]. [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Pg7JmKElUw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Pg7JmKElUw
  - ajross 5y ago
    Ugh. There are no panel gaps shown in the linked video, nor any manufacturing defects. The complaints are about damage and dirt in a loaner vehicle from a service center. This is what I meant. It's a meme. All you care about is that headline ("Tesla Can't Build Cars") and not the truth about anything.
    - eptcyka 5y ago
      It's not a loaner vehicle, it's the replacement for the one that was totaled. Here's another video of a 2021 model year: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFfgpHkNCOM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFfgpHkNCOM
    - jazzyjackson 5y ago