5 ms·

A man growing lettuce for space station salads

78 points by hiddencache 5y ago

hiddencache 5y ago
I wonder why they started with lettuce. I get the nutrients and minerals part, but the calorific value is low. Potatoes also grow well using hydroponics and would seem to be a better base choice for longer orbits.
- luxurytent 5y ago
  Perhaps due to reliable and quick germination? Could allow for regular churn for experiments as you adjust conditions
- WJW 5y ago
  If you are going to build a pilot plant to test things out, it makes sense to make it small, light and not very energy intensive then use v2 and v3 to scale up. Since potatoes contain a lot of energy, they also take a lot of energy to grow. Lettuce is a good crop to start with precisely because it is not very energy dense.
  - hiddencache 5y ago
    Good point, thanks - effectively an MVP approach...
- retrac 5y ago
  Unless this is actually used with some recycling on a long term basis, it's a net loss by weight. Just ship up some cooking oil. So I suspect it's entirely for the practicality and scientific value for now. Lettuce, especially a hardy cultivar, is delicate but fast growing and parasite resistant. And not picky about the growth media usually. Potatoes are slow and I suspect they might start to rot on the space station before they got to full size. Hydroponic potatoes is possible but tricky. But I'm only making a guess from having grown these plants here on Earth. In regard to calories I've heard good things said about oats and switchgrass. Not many people's favourite staples but they grow like weeds under wide climatic conditions with minimal water.
- cwingrav 5y ago
  If you've ever eaten freeze dried, canned and dried foods for extended periods of time, you'll know the joy of something crisp and fresh. Leafy greens are spot on what you'd want. Before refrigeration, greenhouses and global shipping, our ancestors were the same way. It's why something like Polk salad (one of the first greens in Spring) or storing chicory roots for their mid-winter chicon (a single crisp leaf that sprouts from a single root) were so enjoyed. Fresh and green used to be celebrated, before it became too normal to worry about.
  - crymer11 5y ago
    I’m curious to know where you learned about polk salad and that specific name for it. I’ve seen the use of “polk” to refer to “poke” before (the song Polk Salad Annie immediately comes to mind), but I always heard it called “poke” salad, which makes sense given the plant name is pokeweed. That said, hearing it called “poke” could also just be due to the regional accent/dialect of where I’m from.
    - saurik 5y ago
      FWIW, it it seems like it is supposed to be called "poke sallet" (that apparently being a word for a "cooked salad"), so misspelling both words is probably funnier than just one.
- analog31 5y ago
  Nearly the whole plant is edible, no leaves or sticks to dispose.
NickNameNick 5y ago
I have the impression that the space station isn't the most hygienic of environments. I wonder if that poses any problems for growing something like lettuce, with it's very high surface area, for food? Edit: clearly I should have read the whole article before commenting...
- wizzwizz4 5y ago
  I wonder why the redness made it more resistant to E coli growth? It clearly wasn't the colour… but perhaps the pigment.
  - c22 5y ago
    If it's a betalain[0] then there seems to be some evidence for antimicrobial action. "Betalains have been demonstrated to have antiviral, antibacterial, antifungal and antiprotozoal activity...."[1] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betalain https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betalain [1] https://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/26/9/2520/htm https://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/26/9/2520/htm
WJW 5y ago
I was thinking the other day that it seems launching stuff is mostly solved these days but there seems to be a real lack of companies developing "infrastructure" for people once they're up. The only one I know of is Bigelow aerospace, who are working on inflatable space stations that (should) cost a few orders of magnitude less than the current batch of stations. There is also the zero-G ultrapure glass fiber company and the space mining initiative, but they mostly seem to be doing work in space so that they can get the final product back to Earth. Does anyone know of serious companies working on in-orbit manufacturing machines or agricultural equipment? Just a proper CNC lathe or milling machine seems like it would be a giant first step for orbital construction. Perhaps combined with an orbital smelter for making metals out of asteroids.
- lmm 5y ago
  What would such a company be doing right now? I'm sure that we'll eventually want such equipment in orbit, but I don't think working on it now helps us get there - right now a lathe or milling machine in space doesn't make any sense as launching the raw materials would be more expensive than launching the finished part. Maybe for a Mars colony where you want the ability to make replacement parts in situ, or maybe if we were already at the point of having a captured asteroid to work with.
  - WJW 5y ago
    Fair point, though I'll point out that we can also argue there's no point in capturing asteroids until there is machinery available to work with them. I was also just thinking about "boring things" like coffee machines, laundry machines and space beds for the space station hotels that the Bigelow people are designing. Surely you'd want to design those well up front so you can iterate the design a few times before the first guests arrive?
    - icegreentea2 5y ago
      The selling pickaxes to gold miners formula only works when people are pretty sure there is gold. Funding development of orbital smelters would be an incredibly risky proposition given that pay-off would be contingent on someone else figuring out asteroid mining or something. And as for "boring things". Same type of deal. It's risky throwing money at a problem that only has a payoff if someone else succeeds their own high risk activity. Like Bigelow currently has no staff, and has totally missed all of its planned milestones. Especially for the boring stuff, you're also going to be cramped up against someone selling solutions that just apes whatever the ISS does. Does only have instant coffee, and not having real laundry, and having to sleep strapped into a sleeping bag kind of suck? Ya. But YOU'RE IN SPACE (and that's roughly just the same thing as camping). The novelty alone should be enough to tide you through your entire first generation of customers.
fastaguy88 5y ago
Silent Running: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067756/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1 https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067756/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1

78 points by hiddencache 5y ago

I wonder why they started with lettuce. I get the nutrients and minerals part, but the calorific value is low. Potatoes also grow well using hydroponics and would seem to be a better base choice for longer orbits.

luxurytent 5y ago
Perhaps due to reliable and quick germination? Could allow for regular churn for experiments as you adjust conditions
WJW 5y ago
If you are going to build a pilot plant to test things out, it makes sense to make it small, light and not very energy intensive then use v2 and v3 to scale up. Since potatoes contain a lot of energy, they also take a lot of energy to grow. Lettuce is a good crop to start with precisely because it is not very energy dense.
- hiddencache 5y ago
  Good point, thanks - effectively an MVP approach...
retrac 5y ago
Unless this is actually used with some recycling on a long term basis, it's a net loss by weight. Just ship up some cooking oil. So I suspect it's entirely for the practicality and scientific value for now. Lettuce, especially a hardy cultivar, is delicate but fast growing and parasite resistant. And not picky about the growth media usually. Potatoes are slow and I suspect they might start to rot on the space station before they got to full size. Hydroponic potatoes is possible but tricky. But I'm only making a guess from having grown these plants here on Earth. In regard to calories I've heard good things said about oats and switchgrass. Not many people's favourite staples but they grow like weeds under wide climatic conditions with minimal water.
cwingrav 5y ago
If you've ever eaten freeze dried, canned and dried foods for extended periods of time, you'll know the joy of something crisp and fresh. Leafy greens are spot on what you'd want. Before refrigeration, greenhouses and global shipping, our ancestors were the same way. It's why something like Polk salad (one of the first greens in Spring) or storing chicory roots for their mid-winter chicon (a single crisp leaf that sprouts from a single root) were so enjoyed. Fresh and green used to be celebrated, before it became too normal to worry about.
- crymer11 5y ago
  I’m curious to know where you learned about polk salad and that specific name for it. I’ve seen the use of “polk” to refer to “poke” before (the song Polk Salad Annie immediately comes to mind), but I always heard it called “poke” salad, which makes sense given the plant name is pokeweed. That said, hearing it called “poke” could also just be due to the regional accent/dialect of where I’m from.
  - saurik 5y ago
    FWIW, it it seems like it is supposed to be called "poke sallet" (that apparently being a word for a "cooked salad"), so misspelling both words is probably funnier than just one.
analog31 5y ago
Nearly the whole plant is edible, no leaves or sticks to dispose.

NickNameNick 5y ago

I have the impression that the space station isn't the most hygienic of environments. I wonder if that poses any problems for growing something like lettuce, with it's very high surface area, for food? Edit: clearly I should have read the whole article before commenting...

wizzwizz4 5y ago
I wonder why the redness made it more resistant to E coli growth? It clearly wasn't the colour… but perhaps the pigment.
- c22 5y ago
  If it's a betalain[0] then there seems to be some evidence for antimicrobial action. "Betalains have been demonstrated to have antiviral, antibacterial, antifungal and antiprotozoal activity...."[1] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betalain https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betalain [1] https://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/26/9/2520/htm https://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/26/9/2520/htm

WJW 5y ago

I was thinking the other day that it seems launching stuff is mostly solved these days but there seems to be a real lack of companies developing "infrastructure" for people once they're up. The only one I know of is Bigelow aerospace, who are working on inflatable space stations that (should) cost a few orders of magnitude less than the current batch of stations. There is also the zero-G ultrapure glass fiber company and the space mining initiative, but they mostly seem to be doing work in space so that they can get the final product back to Earth. Does anyone know of serious companies working on in-orbit manufacturing machines or agricultural equipment? Just a proper CNC lathe or milling machine seems like it would be a giant first step for orbital construction. Perhaps combined with an orbital smelter for making metals out of asteroids.

lmm 5y ago
What would such a company be doing right now? I'm sure that we'll eventually want such equipment in orbit, but I don't think working on it now helps us get there - right now a lathe or milling machine in space doesn't make any sense as launching the raw materials would be more expensive than launching the finished part. Maybe for a Mars colony where you want the ability to make replacement parts in situ, or maybe if we were already at the point of having a captured asteroid to work with.
- WJW 5y ago
  Fair point, though I'll point out that we can also argue there's no point in capturing asteroids until there is machinery available to work with them. I was also just thinking about "boring things" like coffee machines, laundry machines and space beds for the space station hotels that the Bigelow people are designing. Surely you'd want to design those well up front so you can iterate the design a few times before the first guests arrive?
  - icegreentea2 5y ago
    The selling pickaxes to gold miners formula only works when people are pretty sure there is gold. Funding development of orbital smelters would be an incredibly risky proposition given that pay-off would be contingent on someone else figuring out asteroid mining or something. And as for "boring things". Same type of deal. It's risky throwing money at a problem that only has a payoff if someone else succeeds their own high risk activity. Like Bigelow currently has no staff, and has totally missed all of its planned milestones. Especially for the boring stuff, you're also going to be cramped up against someone selling solutions that just apes whatever the ISS does. Does only have instant coffee, and not having real laundry, and having to sleep strapped into a sleeping bag kind of suck? Ya. But YOU'RE IN SPACE (and that's roughly just the same thing as camping). The novelty alone should be enough to tide you through your entire first generation of customers.

fastaguy88 5y ago

Silent Running: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067756/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1 https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067756/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1