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If the politicians had not spurred faster development by funding competing teams, we wouldn’t be able to stand here today and label one of those teams as a lose

If the politicians had not spurred faster development by funding competing teams, we wouldn’t be able to stand here today and label one of those teams as a loser. One team may be failing, but the broader process has clearly worked to produce revolutionary progress in our space industry.

JPKab 5y ago
Agreed, but based on my 10 years spent in defense work before escaping to startup land, Boeing and Lockheed are bloated, pathologically wasteful defect factories. Their entire business model revolves around winning contracts via paperwork and legal battles not efficiency and quality. Essentially the defense division of Boeing and Northrop Grumman and Lockheed are all rent-seeking organizations. They make extensive use of the revolving door in the military industrial complex as well and that breeds further inefficiency by constantly bringing in bureaucrats. It's utterly corrupt at the leadership level. Generals retire and are given a massive corner office which they almost never sit in, called in occasionally to play golf with another general who is not retired to cement the deal. And don't think for a second they aren't promising the general that hasn't yet retired a job as long as he goes along. That is the business model of these companies and never forget it. Boeing had their shot to make space travel cheaper and they never even tried to make it happen.
- neolog 5y ago
  Do you think this happens to all big contractors and will happen to SpaceX within a few years?
  - Clewza313 5y ago
    Elon has his own agenda and SpaceX is his vehicle to achieve it. If his plan succeeds, we'll have a self-sustaining commercial space industry.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- MilStdJunkie 5y ago
  I almost took my own head off nodding vigorously at this. The "double dipping procurement officer" - the procurement officer arranging a purchase from a supplier that he's already got a job offer from - is so endemic in this sector that these people brag to each other about it over the buffet line at industry conferences. The first time I heard this spiel I thought someone was wearing a wire, but then I realized, slowly, that they didn't care who was listening because literally everyone - from the pentagon down through junior lieutenants and up to the supplier CEOs- was in on this. The corporate "Company-All" email chain is constantly littered with CEO announcements bragging about the latest retired procurement officer they've managed to scam with corner offices and tight little executive assistants. And of course those same officers are the ones who sign waivers allowing substandard everything. MIL-STD avionics can be duct taped in the rack with a waiver from the program office, but the same equipment on a civilian PAX-carrying aircraft need actual testing by qualified people and equipment, no exceptions. And God forbid you get a EUROCAE auditor with the usual FAA mix - hold onto your nuts/ovaries. But the civilian stuff is aboveboard, for the most part, unless you're Boeing. But the MIL-STD stuff . . oh god The defense procurement business is horrifyingly corrupt, maybe even worse than the bureau system of the late USSR, and this is with dollar amounts that dwarf anything you've ever seen anywhere else. Every day I pray to the Defense Gods that a "SpaceX But For Defense" will show up and just blow everyone else out of the water. It might mean the end of my career, but it's what needs to happen.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
garmaine 5y ago
So fund Sierra Nevada instead. Boeing has screwed the pooch.
apendleton 5y ago
... but they're not actually competing if they can overcharge and underdeliver and get contracts anyway. This is the same case that Blue Origin is making with HLS: they submitted a bid for 3x the price and worse performance, and they insist that "competition" demands that they get a contract anyway! How is that competitive?

JPKab 5y ago

Agreed, but based on my 10 years spent in defense work before escaping to startup land, Boeing and Lockheed are bloated, pathologically wasteful defect factories. Their entire business model revolves around winning contracts via paperwork and legal battles not efficiency and quality. Essentially the defense division of Boeing and Northrop Grumman and Lockheed are all rent-seeking organizations. They make extensive use of the revolving door in the military industrial complex as well and that breeds further inefficiency by constantly bringing in bureaucrats. It's utterly corrupt at the leadership level. Generals retire and are given a massive corner office which they almost never sit in, called in occasionally to play golf with another general who is not retired to cement the deal. And don't think for a second they aren't promising the general that hasn't yet retired a job as long as he goes along. That is the business model of these companies and never forget it. Boeing had their shot to make space travel cheaper and they never even tried to make it happen.

neolog 5y ago
Do you think this happens to all big contractors and will happen to SpaceX within a few years?
- Clewza313 5y ago
  Elon has his own agenda and SpaceX is his vehicle to achieve it. If his plan succeeds, we'll have a self-sustaining commercial space industry.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
MilStdJunkie 5y ago
I almost took my own head off nodding vigorously at this. The "double dipping procurement officer" - the procurement officer arranging a purchase from a supplier that he's already got a job offer from - is so endemic in this sector that these people brag to each other about it over the buffet line at industry conferences. The first time I heard this spiel I thought someone was wearing a wire, but then I realized, slowly, that they didn't care who was listening because literally everyone - from the pentagon down through junior lieutenants and up to the supplier CEOs- was in on this. The corporate "Company-All" email chain is constantly littered with CEO announcements bragging about the latest retired procurement officer they've managed to scam with corner offices and tight little executive assistants. And of course those same officers are the ones who sign waivers allowing substandard everything. MIL-STD avionics can be duct taped in the rack with a waiver from the program office, but the same equipment on a civilian PAX-carrying aircraft need actual testing by qualified people and equipment, no exceptions. And God forbid you get a EUROCAE auditor with the usual FAA mix - hold onto your nuts/ovaries. But the civilian stuff is aboveboard, for the most part, unless you're Boeing. But the MIL-STD stuff . . oh god The defense procurement business is horrifyingly corrupt, maybe even worse than the bureau system of the late USSR, and this is with dollar amounts that dwarf anything you've ever seen anywhere else. Every day I pray to the Defense Gods that a "SpaceX But For Defense" will show up and just blow everyone else out of the water. It might mean the end of my career, but it's what needs to happen.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

garmaine 5y ago

So fund Sierra Nevada instead. Boeing has screwed the pooch.

apendleton 5y ago

... but they're not actually competing if they can overcharge and underdeliver and get contracts anyway. This is the same case that Blue Origin is making with HLS: they submitted a bid for 3x the price and worse performance, and they insist that "competition" demands that they get a contract anyway! How is that competitive?