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It's not the idea that's worth $1B. It's the risk the founders/early employees take that make it so valuable. Possibly the founders could take a 9-to-5 job, tha

It's not the idea that's worth $1B. It's the risk the founders/early employees take that make it so valuable. Possibly the founders could take a 9-to-5 job, that would pay them an above average salary. They allowed themselves to go without that steady income, job security to work 24/7 on a project that a few years later could be worth 0$ if it goes wrong. For it to make sense financially, if it is successful it has to pay big time. Probably, you have a few startup ideas yourself, but they are worthless until you put yourself into it.

giantg2 5y ago
I doubt those sacrifices and risks are worth $1B for a single person though.
- cthaeh 5y ago
  If there is asymmetric risk and reward, then do what wall street does: exploit the shit out of it and make bank. Oh wait, most people would rather complain about someone making a billion ("Hur dur he didn't work 1 million times harder than a factory worker Hur dur") than at least try to make your own billion.
  - toomuchtodo 5y ago
    When considering opportunity cost, it’s more time efficient, imho, to live a life well lived and buy lottery tickets than spend decades to “earn” a billion when it’s more luck than “hard work.” You can do everything right and still fail (startup failure, early employee dilution, etc). You can also fail your way to being a billionaire (Adam Neumann @ WeWork). Best to recognize the sham (most startups fail, most startup equity ends up worthless or at parity with what you would’ve earned as wages elsewhere) before you’ve spent too much precious time on it you can never buy back. Survivorship bias is rampant in the startup scene, Silicon Valley even more so. One of my side projects is a website where you can convert startup equity offers to the number of lottery tickets you need to buy to have equal odds of financial success (while working a more stable and/or lucrative job), it’s just not done yet. I hope to share it soon! TLDR Don’t work at a startup, get exposure to that asset class or equivalent returns via other means. You’re just making founders and investment funds wealthy with your precious time.
    - cthaeh 5y ago
      Your goal shouldnt be to work at at an early startup. As you mentioned it's not worth it. Your goal is to be a founder at a startup, and for all of people's claims that startup success is entirely luck that is not true. Luck certainly plays a role, hell being in the position to choose between being a founder vs employee of someone else startup requires incredible luck, on a global scale. But, me and you, the privileged 0.1% of the world, are masters of our destiny. To claim otherwise is to accept mediocrity as inevitable and not the consequences of our decisions.
      - toomuchtodo 5y ago
        I’m at not so delusional as to believe in this level of exceptionalism. Strive for success, but humility is equally important.
        cthaeh 5y ago
        As a 0.1%er you are already exceptionally lucky. What's 1 more roll of the dice?
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        giantg2 5y ago
        I would say that depends on the opportunity costs and how many sides those dice have. Also, I'm curious where you got that .1% number.
  - giantg2 5y ago
    Your comment exemplifies my point. I don't think people should be exploiting their employees. Frankly, if I make $1B for myself and not at least 10% as much for each of my employees, then I'm not a good leader in my own opinion. And, oh wait, I guess some people would rather complain about people complaining rather than make their own $1B...
    - cthaeh 5y ago
      Who says I'm not trying to make my own billion?
      - giantg2 5y ago
        I would say if you're wasting time browsing this site and engaging in conversation, then you're not really trying. That time would be spent on your company (look at other self-made billionaires).
        cthaeh 5y ago
        I'll bookmark this. See you in 10 years, and you'd better hope this comment doesn't turn into the infamous Dropbox comment.
        giantg2 5y ago
        Why would I care? Whether you make a billion or not doesn't affect me. Statistically speaking, the odds are very much in my favor. I hope you do make it, and that you use much of it to give your employees great bonuses and give to charity.
- hemantv 5y ago
  It's not based upon what's It's worth It's based what market is willing to pay. How much vc want to pay for fundraising, how much employees will accept to work and ultimately how much acquiring company is willing to pay This is what most people don't understand about capitalism, it's not about fair or just it's about what markets are willing to pay for it
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
raffraffraff 5y ago
Founders who get VC capital to pay wages and compute costs are also taking a pay check. They're not going without.
- hemantv 5y ago
  If it's so easy why don't you start a company and ask VC to pay your salary. It's a free country no one is stopping you from doing that
  - raffraffraff 5y ago
    I'm not sure what you're getting at. "Just start a company and ask a VC..." Getting VC funding is the hard part. I'm not saying that it's easy. And obviously there are going to be some strings attached - VCs typically want board seats, significant input into company decision making, along with a chunk of the company. But are you telling me that it's common for a VC to stipulate that founders can't take a monthly pay check? Really. Honest question: how common is that?

giantg2 5y ago

I doubt those sacrifices and risks are worth $1B for a single person though.

cthaeh 5y ago
If there is asymmetric risk and reward, then do what wall street does: exploit the shit out of it and make bank. Oh wait, most people would rather complain about someone making a billion ("Hur dur he didn't work 1 million times harder than a factory worker Hur dur") than at least try to make your own billion.
- toomuchtodo 5y ago
  When considering opportunity cost, it’s more time efficient, imho, to live a life well lived and buy lottery tickets than spend decades to “earn” a billion when it’s more luck than “hard work.” You can do everything right and still fail (startup failure, early employee dilution, etc). You can also fail your way to being a billionaire (Adam Neumann @ WeWork). Best to recognize the sham (most startups fail, most startup equity ends up worthless or at parity with what you would’ve earned as wages elsewhere) before you’ve spent too much precious time on it you can never buy back. Survivorship bias is rampant in the startup scene, Silicon Valley even more so. One of my side projects is a website where you can convert startup equity offers to the number of lottery tickets you need to buy to have equal odds of financial success (while working a more stable and/or lucrative job), it’s just not done yet. I hope to share it soon! TLDR Don’t work at a startup, get exposure to that asset class or equivalent returns via other means. You’re just making founders and investment funds wealthy with your precious time.
  - cthaeh 5y ago
    Your goal shouldnt be to work at at an early startup. As you mentioned it's not worth it. Your goal is to be a founder at a startup, and for all of people's claims that startup success is entirely luck that is not true. Luck certainly plays a role, hell being in the position to choose between being a founder vs employee of someone else startup requires incredible luck, on a global scale. But, me and you, the privileged 0.1% of the world, are masters of our destiny. To claim otherwise is to accept mediocrity as inevitable and not the consequences of our decisions.
    - toomuchtodo 5y ago
      I’m at not so delusional as to believe in this level of exceptionalism. Strive for success, but humility is equally important.
      - cthaeh 5y ago
        As a 0.1%er you are already exceptionally lucky. What's 1 more roll of the dice?
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        giantg2 5y ago
        I would say that depends on the opportunity costs and how many sides those dice have. Also, I'm curious where you got that .1% number.
- giantg2 5y ago
  Your comment exemplifies my point. I don't think people should be exploiting their employees. Frankly, if I make $1B for myself and not at least 10% as much for each of my employees, then I'm not a good leader in my own opinion. And, oh wait, I guess some people would rather complain about people complaining rather than make their own $1B...
  - cthaeh 5y ago
    Who says I'm not trying to make my own billion?
    - giantg2 5y ago
      I would say if you're wasting time browsing this site and engaging in conversation, then you're not really trying. That time would be spent on your company (look at other self-made billionaires).
      - cthaeh 5y ago
        I'll bookmark this. See you in 10 years, and you'd better hope this comment doesn't turn into the infamous Dropbox comment.
        giantg2 5y ago
        Why would I care? Whether you make a billion or not doesn't affect me. Statistically speaking, the odds are very much in my favor. I hope you do make it, and that you use much of it to give your employees great bonuses and give to charity.
hemantv 5y ago
It's not based upon what's It's worth It's based what market is willing to pay. How much vc want to pay for fundraising, how much employees will accept to work and ultimately how much acquiring company is willing to pay This is what most people don't understand about capitalism, it's not about fair or just it's about what markets are willing to pay for it
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

raffraffraff 5y ago

Founders who get VC capital to pay wages and compute costs are also taking a pay check. They're not going without.

hemantv 5y ago
If it's so easy why don't you start a company and ask VC to pay your salary. It's a free country no one is stopping you from doing that
- raffraffraff 5y ago
  I'm not sure what you're getting at. "Just start a company and ask a VC..." Getting VC funding is the hard part. I'm not saying that it's easy. And obviously there are going to be some strings attached - VCs typically want board seats, significant input into company decision making, along with a chunk of the company. But are you telling me that it's common for a VC to stipulate that founders can't take a monthly pay check? Really. Honest question: how common is that?