5 ms·

No, the threat model differs entirely. Local scanning introduces a whole host of single points of failure, including the 'independent auditor' & involuntary sca

No, the threat model differs entirely. Local scanning introduces a whole host of single points of failure, including the 'independent auditor' & involuntary scans, that risk the privacy & security of all local files on a device. Cloud scanning largely precludes these potential vulnerabilities.

majormajor 5y ago
Your phone threat model should already include "the OS author has full access to do whatever they want to whatever data is on my phone, and can change what they do any time they push out an update." I don't think anyone's necessarily being too upset or paranoid about THIS, but maybe everyone should also be a little less trusting of every closed OS - macOS, Windows, Android as provided by Google - that has root access too.
- himaraya 5y ago
  Sure, but that doesn't change the fact that the vulnerabilities with local scanning remain a significant superset of cloud scanning's. Apple has built iOS off user trust & goodwill, unlike most other OSes.
  - shuckles 5y ago
    Cloud Scanning vulnerability: no transparency over data use. On the phone, you can always confirm the contents of what’s added to the safety voucher’s associated data. On the cloud, anything about your photos is fair game. Where does that fit in your set intersection?
    - himaraya 5y ago
      > On the phone, you can always confirm the contents of what’s added to the safety voucher’s associated data. ...except you can't? Not sure where these assumptions come from.
      - ec109685 5y ago
        It’s code running your device is the point, so while “you” doesn’t include everyone, it does include people who will verify this to a greater extent than if done on cloud.
lttlrck 5y ago
It differs, but iOS already scans images locally and we really don't know what they do with the meta data, and what "hidden" categories there are.
- himaraya 5y ago
  Yes, exactly why Apple breaching user trust matters.
  - shuckles 5y ago
    And how is telling you in great detail about what they’re planning to do months before they do it and giving you a way to opt out in advance a breach of trust? What more did you expect from them?
    - himaraya 5y ago
      You forgot, 'after it leaked'
      - shuckles 5y ago
        It’s almost certain the “leak” was from someone they had pre-briefed prior to a launch. You don’t put together 80+ pages of technical documentation with multiple expert testimony in 16 hours.
        himaraya 5y ago
        'Almost certain'? Have you heard of contingency planning?
    - stale2002 5y ago
      > What more did you expect from them? Well they could not do it.
      - shuckles 5y ago
shuckles 5y ago
What’s the difference between hybrid cloud/local scanning “due to a bug” checking all your files and uploading too many safety vouchers and cloud scanning “due to a bug” uploading all your files and checking them there?
- himaraya 5y ago
  ...because cloud uploads require explicit user consent, practically speaking? Apple's system requires none.
  - shuckles 5y ago
    I think the mods should consider shadow banning you. Your comments make little sense.
    - himaraya 5y ago
      Ditto, too bad you got flagged earlier
  - kemayo 5y ago
    Wouldn't both of those scenarios imply that the "bug" is bypassing any normal user consent? They're only practically different in that the "upload them all for cloud-scanning" one would take longer and use more bandwidth, but I suspect very few people would notice.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - himaraya 5y ago
      I think the difference lies in the visibility of each system in typical use. Apple's local scanning remains invisible to the user, in contrast to cloud uploading.

majormajor 5y ago

Your phone threat model should already include "the OS author has full access to do whatever they want to whatever data is on my phone, and can change what they do any time they push out an update." I don't think anyone's necessarily being too upset or paranoid about THIS, but maybe everyone should also be a little less trusting of every closed OS - macOS, Windows, Android as provided by Google - that has root access too.

himaraya 5y ago
Sure, but that doesn't change the fact that the vulnerabilities with local scanning remain a significant superset of cloud scanning's. Apple has built iOS off user trust & goodwill, unlike most other OSes.
- shuckles 5y ago
  Cloud Scanning vulnerability: no transparency over data use. On the phone, you can always confirm the contents of what’s added to the safety voucher’s associated data. On the cloud, anything about your photos is fair game. Where does that fit in your set intersection?
  - himaraya 5y ago
    > On the phone, you can always confirm the contents of what’s added to the safety voucher’s associated data. ...except you can't? Not sure where these assumptions come from.
    - ec109685 5y ago
      It’s code running your device is the point, so while “you” doesn’t include everyone, it does include people who will verify this to a greater extent than if done on cloud.

lttlrck 5y ago

It differs, but iOS already scans images locally and we really don't know what they do with the meta data, and what "hidden" categories there are.

himaraya 5y ago
Yes, exactly why Apple breaching user trust matters.
- shuckles 5y ago
  And how is telling you in great detail about what they’re planning to do months before they do it and giving you a way to opt out in advance a breach of trust? What more did you expect from them?
  - himaraya 5y ago
    You forgot, 'after it leaked'
    - shuckles 5y ago
      It’s almost certain the “leak” was from someone they had pre-briefed prior to a launch. You don’t put together 80+ pages of technical documentation with multiple expert testimony in 16 hours.
      - himaraya 5y ago
        'Almost certain'? Have you heard of contingency planning?
  - stale2002 5y ago
    > What more did you expect from them? Well they could not do it.
    - shuckles 5y ago

shuckles 5y ago

What’s the difference between hybrid cloud/local scanning “due to a bug” checking all your files and uploading too many safety vouchers and cloud scanning “due to a bug” uploading all your files and checking them there?

himaraya 5y ago
...because cloud uploads require explicit user consent, practically speaking? Apple's system requires none.
- shuckles 5y ago
  I think the mods should consider shadow banning you. Your comments make little sense.
  - himaraya 5y ago
    Ditto, too bad you got flagged earlier
- kemayo 5y ago
  Wouldn't both of those scenarios imply that the "bug" is bypassing any normal user consent? They're only practically different in that the "upload them all for cloud-scanning" one would take longer and use more bandwidth, but I suspect very few people would notice.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - himaraya 5y ago
    I think the difference lies in the visibility of each system in typical use. Apple's local scanning remains invisible to the user, in contrast to cloud uploading.