4 ms·

So for languages like Clojure,Scala does this offer any new feature for them?

by nkassis 15y ago

bensummers 15y ago
For dynamic JVM languages, the new invokedynamic bytecode is a huge performance boost.
- Mitt 15y ago
  Probably not. See what Rich Hickey said about this: http://clojure-log.n01se.net/date/2008-09-03.html#09:13a http://clojure-log.n01se.net/date/2008-09-03.html#09:13a
  - runevault 15y ago
    For clojure no, but jRuby and several similar languages are getting a huge boost.
    - PyErr_SetString 15y ago
      Have you seen any actual numbers on this? I've googled around a bit and can't seem to find any.
      - runevault 15y ago
        JRuby developer Charles Nutter claims that Java JDK7 gives a performance boost to JRuby, saying "On bench_threaded_reverse, Java 7 is 20% faster than Java 6, and JRuby plus invokedynamic is 20% faster than that".[1] From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JRuby http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JRuby with the [1] being https://twitter.com/#!/headius/status/78282122997149696 https://twitter.com/#!/headius/status/78282122997149696
  - kingkilr 15y ago
    I'm a little disappointed that people are still talking about tagged ints. There are so many better ways to avoid the overheap of integers being a refrence type (namely type specializing everything under the sun, particularly your JIT'd code and data structures).
    - xyzzyz 15y ago
      Could you please tell me something more about it? Tagged unboxed data seems to be a nice solution for me.
      - kingkilr 15y ago
        Well, the problem with it is it has a negative performance impact on everything else in your codebase, the first time you see any pointer you need to check if it's tagged or not. The advantages are clear: you don't need to allocate anything on the heap for integers. Which means you're sacrificing performance on everything else, for integers. Solutions such as automatic type-specializing containers don't carry this downside, and carry the same upside. For example at the moment PyPy type-specializes dictionaries. Python has a single `dict` type, which can store anything, but we type specialize and fallback if we get it wrong. Similarly, we're working on type-specializng lists, tuples, and user objects. If there's anything more I can answer let me know.
jawher 15y ago
Yes, invokedynamic[1] 1. http://blog.headius.com/2008/09/first-taste-of-invokedynamic.html http://blog.headius.com/2008/09/first-taste-of-invokedynamic...
Mitt 15y ago
Yes, Clojure will profit from Fork/Join: http://download.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/essential/concurrency/forkjoin.html http://download.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/essential/concurr... For example see here, pvec: http://clojure.org/other_libraries http://clojure.org/other_libraries Of course, improvements like the GC1, improvements in HotSpot etc, they all will make Clojure apps run even faster.
- runevault 15y ago
  Oh nice, I thought F/J got pushed into 8. Glad to see I was wrong.
ghotli 15y ago
Yes [1]. Invokedynamic (JSR-262). Quote from an older article [2]: "... enable[s] implementers of compilers for dynamically typed languages, that is, the people who develop compilers for languages such as JRuby and Jython, to generate bytecode that runs extremely fast in the JVM." [1] http://blogs.oracle.com/jrose/entry/jsr_292_launched_in_java http://blogs.oracle.com/jrose/entry/jsr_292_launched_in_java [2] http://java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/DynTypeLang/index.html http://java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/DynTypeLang/...
- gvkv 15y ago
  Whoo-hoo! Time for the Perl port.
  - sigzero 15y ago
    Good luck with that wish.
    - bowyakka 15y ago
      I would have to lookup the serious academic paper that says peel is technically unparsable in the same ways as PL/1. I think to date there have been two aborted perk on java efforts Not sure if perl6 has the same properties mind.
      - rat 15y ago
        I think perl6 is meant to have mutiple implementations.
      - bowyakka 15y ago
        I wish I had checked that over I just saw that my phone mangled perl twice
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
- peterb 15y ago

So for languages like Clojure,Scala does this offer any new feature for them?

by nkassis 15y ago

So for languages like Clojure,Scala does this offer any new feature for them?

bensummers 15y ago

For dynamic JVM languages, the new invokedynamic bytecode is a huge performance boost.

Mitt 15y ago
Probably not. See what Rich Hickey said about this: http://clojure-log.n01se.net/date/2008-09-03.html#09:13a http://clojure-log.n01se.net/date/2008-09-03.html#09:13a
- runevault 15y ago
  For clojure no, but jRuby and several similar languages are getting a huge boost.
  - PyErr_SetString 15y ago
    Have you seen any actual numbers on this? I've googled around a bit and can't seem to find any.
    - runevault 15y ago
      JRuby developer Charles Nutter claims that Java JDK7 gives a performance boost to JRuby, saying "On bench_threaded_reverse, Java 7 is 20% faster than Java 6, and JRuby plus invokedynamic is 20% faster than that".[1] From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JRuby http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JRuby with the [1] being https://twitter.com/#!/headius/status/78282122997149696 https://twitter.com/#!/headius/status/78282122997149696
- kingkilr 15y ago
  I'm a little disappointed that people are still talking about tagged ints. There are so many better ways to avoid the overheap of integers being a refrence type (namely type specializing everything under the sun, particularly your JIT'd code and data structures).
  - xyzzyz 15y ago
    Could you please tell me something more about it? Tagged unboxed data seems to be a nice solution for me.
    - kingkilr 15y ago
      Well, the problem with it is it has a negative performance impact on everything else in your codebase, the first time you see any pointer you need to check if it's tagged or not. The advantages are clear: you don't need to allocate anything on the heap for integers. Which means you're sacrificing performance on everything else, for integers. Solutions such as automatic type-specializing containers don't carry this downside, and carry the same upside. For example at the moment PyPy type-specializes dictionaries. Python has a single `dict` type, which can store anything, but we type specialize and fallback if we get it wrong. Similarly, we're working on type-specializng lists, tuples, and user objects. If there's anything more I can answer let me know.

jawher 15y ago

Yes, invokedynamic[1] 1. http://blog.headius.com/2008/09/first-taste-of-invokedynamic.html http://blog.headius.com/2008/09/first-taste-of-invokedynamic...

Mitt 15y ago

Yes, Clojure will profit from Fork/Join: http://download.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/essential/concurrency/forkjoin.html http://download.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/essential/concurr... For example see here, pvec: http://clojure.org/other_libraries http://clojure.org/other_libraries Of course, improvements like the GC1, improvements in HotSpot etc, they all will make Clojure apps run even faster.

runevault 15y ago
Oh nice, I thought F/J got pushed into 8. Glad to see I was wrong.

ghotli 15y ago

Yes [1]. Invokedynamic (JSR-262). Quote from an older article [2]: "... enable[s] implementers of compilers for dynamically typed languages, that is, the people who develop compilers for languages such as JRuby and Jython, to generate bytecode that runs extremely fast in the JVM." [1] http://blogs.oracle.com/jrose/entry/jsr_292_launched_in_java http://blogs.oracle.com/jrose/entry/jsr_292_launched_in_java [2] http://java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/DynTypeLang/index.html http://java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/DynTypeLang/...

gvkv 15y ago
Whoo-hoo! Time for the Perl port.
- sigzero 15y ago
  Good luck with that wish.
  - bowyakka 15y ago
    I would have to lookup the serious academic paper that says peel is technically unparsable in the same ways as PL/1. I think to date there have been two aborted perk on java efforts Not sure if perl6 has the same properties mind.
    - rat 15y ago
      I think perl6 is meant to have mutiple implementations.
    - bowyakka 15y ago
      I wish I had checked that over I just saw that my phone mangled perl twice
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
peterb 15y ago