5 ms·

> Apple will absolutely check images on your device. Yes, they will check the images you have chosen to upload. No ‘scanning is involved’. Claiming this is ‘

by zepto 5y ago

> Apple will absolutely check images on your device. Yes, they will check the images you have chosen to upload. No ‘scanning is involved’. Claiming this is ‘scanning users devices’ is just dishonest - it’s obvious that it creates a false dichotomy impression of what they are actually doing. Don’t do that.

swiley 5y ago
What about when your iCloud account is full (the default storage size is useless if you enable any kind of backup) so the photos never get uploaded?
- zepto 5y ago
  Right.
zekrioca 5y ago
Check == Scanning, because to create the output, the hash function needs to “scan” the whole blob.
- zepto 5y ago
  Even if we accept that. It is a lie to say the device is being scanned. It is definitely not. Only the photos the user chooses to upload are checked. That is not the device.
  - zekrioca 5y ago
    It is part of the device, and this specific part is being scanned. Can I physically remove this “checking” part and end up with a working iDevice D that resembles D = {{Device \ {/iCloud/Photo Library}}? Frame it the way you want. It is the device.
    - zepto 5y ago
      The checking is being done on the device. Nobody disputes that. Indeed it is being marketed by Apple as a feature. Yes, this feature is part of the device. If you say Apple is scanning the device, you are lying. They are not scanning the device. They are scanning photos chosen for upload.
      - zekrioca 5y ago
        Another commenter put it in better terms, so you may understand it: Suppose we know there are people who smuggle drugs on airplanes on their person for the purpose of something terrible, like addicting children or poisoning people. If I run an airport I could say: to stop this, I'm going to subject everyone who flies out of my airport to a body-cavity search. Tim, and Craig, are you OK with this? If I can say, "Don't worry! We have created this great robots that ensure the body cavity searches are gentle and the minimum needed to check for illegal drugs," does it really change anything to make it more acceptable to you?
        zepto 5y ago
        I haven’t said anything about what is acceptable. I was just pointing out a falsehood you wrote about what is actually being done.
        zekrioca 5y ago
        No falsehoods, it is the device, even though it is only a specific part of it. I know you got the point I tried (or rather, the other commenter) to make about the part of someone's body meaning "the whole" of a person. Same philosophical view can be applied to the device. Anyway, someone in here can accept what the other can't, so let's leave at that and let history tells.
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        5y ago
teclordphrack2 5y ago
What about all the images already in the iCloud?
durovo 5y ago
You spend almost too much time defending Apple[0]. If you have any association with them, you should probably disclose that first. 0. Check the comment history, every comment is defending Apple and this has been going on for many months (years?). In fact, I don't see any comment that is not defending Apple. I know I am making very serious allegations, but please go through the comment history to form your own opinion. I don't believe that the user is a bot though, most comments are 'well-reasoned'.
- JeremyHerrman 5y ago
  Wow you're right - over the past 9 days zepto's generated ~5 pages of comments defending Apple's scanning. Why would one dedicate so much time and effort to rise to the defense of a trillion dollar company?
  - zepto 5y ago
    I have a bunch of time on my hands right now. This is a good way to pass the time when for reasons beyond my control I can’t be working on projects.
  - mthoms 5y ago
    9 days? Ha. It's been months (if not years) of this user vehemently defending Apple, regardless of what the issue at hand is. The amount of time he or she has invested in sticking up for Apple is astronomical.
- zepto 5y ago
  First of all, I have no affiliation with Apple, not do I own any Apple stock. Do you have any affiliations we should be aware of? Secondly, I haven’t ‘defended Apple’ in any comments. Indeed there are comments in which I make a judgement about this topic where I say that what Apple is doing is distasteful and offensive. Elsewhere I have pointed out that if Apple wants to scan people’s devices they have many other mechanisms at their fingertips than this narrowly tailored tool. What exactly do you think I’m ‘defending Apple’ from? Quite a few of my comments are critical of false or immaculate characterizations of what Apple is actually doing. If you consider that to be a defense of Apple, then I disagree. For the most part there just seems to be a lot of confusion about what Apple is doing, and general frustration about the state of computing. Do you really think of these as ‘attacks’ on Apple?

by zepto 5y ago

swiley 5y ago

What about when your iCloud account is full (the default storage size is useless if you enable any kind of backup) so the photos never get uploaded?

zepto 5y ago
Right.

zekrioca 5y ago

Check == Scanning, because to create the output, the hash function needs to “scan” the whole blob.

zepto 5y ago
Even if we accept that. It is a lie to say the device is being scanned. It is definitely not. Only the photos the user chooses to upload are checked. That is not the device.
- zekrioca 5y ago
  It is part of the device, and this specific part is being scanned. Can I physically remove this “checking” part and end up with a working iDevice D that resembles D = {{Device \ {/iCloud/Photo Library}}? Frame it the way you want. It is the device.
  - zepto 5y ago
    The checking is being done on the device. Nobody disputes that. Indeed it is being marketed by Apple as a feature. Yes, this feature is part of the device. If you say Apple is scanning the device, you are lying. They are not scanning the device. They are scanning photos chosen for upload.
    - zekrioca 5y ago
      Another commenter put it in better terms, so you may understand it: Suppose we know there are people who smuggle drugs on airplanes on their person for the purpose of something terrible, like addicting children or poisoning people. If I run an airport I could say: to stop this, I'm going to subject everyone who flies out of my airport to a body-cavity search. Tim, and Craig, are you OK with this? If I can say, "Don't worry! We have created this great robots that ensure the body cavity searches are gentle and the minimum needed to check for illegal drugs," does it really change anything to make it more acceptable to you?
      - zepto 5y ago
        I haven’t said anything about what is acceptable. I was just pointing out a falsehood you wrote about what is actually being done.
        zekrioca 5y ago
        No falsehoods, it is the device, even though it is only a specific part of it. I know you got the point I tried (or rather, the other commenter) to make about the part of someone's body meaning "the whole" of a person. Same philosophical view can be applied to the device. Anyway, someone in here can accept what the other can't, so let's leave at that and let history tells.
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        5y ago

teclordphrack2 5y ago

What about all the images already in the iCloud?

durovo 5y ago

You spend almost too much time defending Apple[0]. If you have any association with them, you should probably disclose that first. 0. Check the comment history, every comment is defending Apple and this has been going on for many months (years?). In fact, I don't see any comment that is not defending Apple. I know I am making very serious allegations, but please go through the comment history to form your own opinion. I don't believe that the user is a bot though, most comments are 'well-reasoned'.

JeremyHerrman 5y ago
Wow you're right - over the past 9 days zepto's generated ~5 pages of comments defending Apple's scanning. Why would one dedicate so much time and effort to rise to the defense of a trillion dollar company?
- zepto 5y ago
  I have a bunch of time on my hands right now. This is a good way to pass the time when for reasons beyond my control I can’t be working on projects.
- mthoms 5y ago
  9 days? Ha. It's been months (if not years) of this user vehemently defending Apple, regardless of what the issue at hand is. The amount of time he or she has invested in sticking up for Apple is astronomical.
zepto 5y ago
First of all, I have no affiliation with Apple, not do I own any Apple stock. Do you have any affiliations we should be aware of? Secondly, I haven’t ‘defended Apple’ in any comments. Indeed there are comments in which I make a judgement about this topic where I say that what Apple is doing is distasteful and offensive. Elsewhere I have pointed out that if Apple wants to scan people’s devices they have many other mechanisms at their fingertips than this narrowly tailored tool. What exactly do you think I’m ‘defending Apple’ from? Quite a few of my comments are critical of false or immaculate characterizations of what Apple is actually doing. If you consider that to be a defense of Apple, then I disagree. For the most part there just seems to be a lot of confusion about what Apple is doing, and general frustration about the state of computing. Do you really think of these as ‘attacks’ on Apple?