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It's not a tool to fight child porn. It's a tool for surveillance and policing, plus a current policy to fight child porn with it. The difference matters becau

by neolog 5y ago

It's not a tool to fight child porn. It's a tool for surveillance and policing, plus a current policy to fight child porn with it. The difference matters because once they have implemented the technology, they can't respond to government demands with "we don't have the capability to report dissidents". Apple shouldn't do this. Scan iCloud, not people's personal phones. If you work for Apple, push back. You can make a difference.

fsflover 5y ago
> they can't respond to government demands with "we don't have the capability to report dissidents". > Apple shouldn't do this. But they have already done this.
- neolog 5y ago
  They haven't deployed it yet.
alwillis 5y ago
Scanning iCloud is far less privacy preserving. That means Apple “knows” about all of your photos. With what Apple is proposing, Apple knows nothing about any of your photos unless you reach a threshold of about 30 CSAM images through the use of cryptographic safety vouchers uploaded with each image. That is, if through cryptography, about 30 of the images can be proven to be a subset of a combination of CSAM images from multiple databases is the only time when anyone other than the user can learn anything about the photos.
- neolog 5y ago
  iCloud is already available for lawful intercept. It's not E2EE because the FBI requested it. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-fbi-icloud-exclusive-idUSKBN1ZK1CT https://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-fbi-icloud-exclusiv...
  - alwillis 5y ago
    iCloud is already available for lawful intercept. It's not E2EE because the FBI requested it. Well, we don't know the details. But what we do know is Apple can't encrypt all of iCloud without solving CSAM first.
    - neolog 5y ago
      They can scan before sharing a file, like Dropbox does.
istingray 5y ago
"It's not a tool to fight child porn. It's a tool for surveillance and policing, plus a current policy to fight child porn with it." This is a great way to frame it, clarified a lot for me.

by neolog 5y ago

fsflover 5y ago

> they can't respond to government demands with "we don't have the capability to report dissidents". > Apple shouldn't do this. But they have already done this.

neolog 5y ago
They haven't deployed it yet.

alwillis 5y ago

Scanning iCloud is far less privacy preserving. That means Apple “knows” about all of your photos. With what Apple is proposing, Apple knows nothing about any of your photos unless you reach a threshold of about 30 CSAM images through the use of cryptographic safety vouchers uploaded with each image. That is, if through cryptography, about 30 of the images can be proven to be a subset of a combination of CSAM images from multiple databases is the only time when anyone other than the user can learn anything about the photos.

neolog 5y ago
iCloud is already available for lawful intercept. It's not E2EE because the FBI requested it. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-fbi-icloud-exclusive-idUSKBN1ZK1CT https://www.reuters.com/article/us-apple-fbi-icloud-exclusiv...
- alwillis 5y ago
  iCloud is already available for lawful intercept. It's not E2EE because the FBI requested it. Well, we don't know the details. But what we do know is Apple can't encrypt all of iCloud without solving CSAM first.
  - neolog 5y ago
    They can scan before sharing a file, like Dropbox does.

istingray 5y ago

"It's not a tool to fight child porn. It's a tool for surveillance and policing, plus a current policy to fight child porn with it." This is a great way to frame it, clarified a lot for me.