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Yes. The economic aspect has figured into calculations but there’s been no transparency around that fact. The news media are the worst in this regard. For those

Yes. The economic aspect has figured into calculations but there’s been no transparency around that fact. The news media are the worst in this regard. For those of us with very high risk loved ones who refuse to accept any facts that aren’t broadcast in full force through the usual dumbed down news outlets which I won’t name directly, it’s been a horrifyingly stressful month.

HarryHirsch 5y ago
the usual dumbed down news outlets You mean NPR where recently Atul Gawande was calling the pandemic a "pandemic of the unvaccinated" and urged everyone to take the vaccine? He's right in a way, being vaccinated keeps you out of hospital, but it won't prevent you that much from catching the disease and developing post-covid syndrome. And you can still spread the virus in your community.
- jhayward 5y ago
  > He's right in a way, being vaccinated keeps you out of hospital, but it won't prevent you that much from catching the disease and developing post-covid syndrome This is misinformation. From the data we have available, vaccination prevents at least 80% of symptomatic infections with the Delta variant. To characterize an 80% reduction in risk as “not that much” is simply trying to get people to give up on vaccines.
  - HarryHirsch 5y ago
    You see papers claiming an effectiveness against symptomatic infection against Delta of ~ 50 %, and the rise of cases in Israel as well as the Provincetown outbreak should really make us concerned. The vaccine still prevents hospitalization and death, so that's reason enough to take it. But on its own it isn't enough to get R_0 below 1. The way everyone is behaving, they are asking for outbreak after outbreak.
    - newbamboo 5y ago
      Yes, it’s at 47% now if I’m up to date.
      - chiefalchemist 5y ago
        Wasn't it up around 75% in Providence RI? Yes, an outlier but it's indicative of the potential.
        newbamboo 5y ago
        Guess it’s 42% for Pfizer according to this preprint.[1] That’s July, so presumably even lower now. I thought I saw 47% somewhere more official but can’t find it now. [1]https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.06.21261707v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.06.21261707v... “ However, in July, the effectiveness against infection was considerably lower for mRNA-1273 (76%, 95% CI: 58-87%) with an even more pronounced reduction in effectiveness for BNT162b2 (42%, 95% CI: 13-62%).”
- chiefalchemist 5y ago
  "Pandemic of the unvaxinated" should be relabled "Pandemic of the non-existent leadership." You don't get someone on board by marginalizing and alienating them.
- newbamboo 5y ago
  Not naming names, but it’s easy to be left with the impression that if you are vaccinated and wear a mask, and your social circle are all vaccinated, that there is negligible risk. The media as a whole have not done much to rectify this false impression though they’ve chosen their words carefully to avoid being responsible for such misunderstandings. It’s frustrating to say the least. Reminds me of “Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia.”

HarryHirsch 5y ago

the usual dumbed down news outlets You mean NPR where recently Atul Gawande was calling the pandemic a "pandemic of the unvaccinated" and urged everyone to take the vaccine? He's right in a way, being vaccinated keeps you out of hospital, but it won't prevent you that much from catching the disease and developing post-covid syndrome. And you can still spread the virus in your community.

jhayward 5y ago
> He's right in a way, being vaccinated keeps you out of hospital, but it won't prevent you that much from catching the disease and developing post-covid syndrome This is misinformation. From the data we have available, vaccination prevents at least 80% of symptomatic infections with the Delta variant. To characterize an 80% reduction in risk as “not that much” is simply trying to get people to give up on vaccines.
- HarryHirsch 5y ago
  You see papers claiming an effectiveness against symptomatic infection against Delta of ~ 50 %, and the rise of cases in Israel as well as the Provincetown outbreak should really make us concerned. The vaccine still prevents hospitalization and death, so that's reason enough to take it. But on its own it isn't enough to get R_0 below 1. The way everyone is behaving, they are asking for outbreak after outbreak.
  - newbamboo 5y ago
    Yes, it’s at 47% now if I’m up to date.
    - chiefalchemist 5y ago
      Wasn't it up around 75% in Providence RI? Yes, an outlier but it's indicative of the potential.
      - newbamboo 5y ago
        Guess it’s 42% for Pfizer according to this preprint.[1] That’s July, so presumably even lower now. I thought I saw 47% somewhere more official but can’t find it now. [1]https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.06.21261707v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.06.21261707v... “ However, in July, the effectiveness against infection was considerably lower for mRNA-1273 (76%, 95% CI: 58-87%) with an even more pronounced reduction in effectiveness for BNT162b2 (42%, 95% CI: 13-62%).”
chiefalchemist 5y ago
"Pandemic of the unvaxinated" should be relabled "Pandemic of the non-existent leadership." You don't get someone on board by marginalizing and alienating them.
newbamboo 5y ago
Not naming names, but it’s easy to be left with the impression that if you are vaccinated and wear a mask, and your social circle are all vaccinated, that there is negligible risk. The media as a whole have not done much to rectify this false impression though they’ve chosen their words carefully to avoid being responsible for such misunderstandings. It’s frustrating to say the least. Reminds me of “Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia.”