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That seems awkward. Shouldn’t the British diplomat be spying for Britain?

by ashtonkem 5y ago

gruez 5y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_agent https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_agent
- ashtonkem 5y ago
  The joke is that a diplomat spying on their host country on behalf of their parent country is expected behavior; it’s only awkward if you get caught. There are polite ways of dealing with that, usually by declaring them persona non grata and asking them to leave. Spying on your host country on behalf of someone else though, that gets you arrested.
  - Blikkentrekker 5y ago
    I find it so strange to punish the diplomat in that case rather than the the parent country, — though I assume it will sour relationships. I doubt the diplomat had much of a say in it. Are spies in general treated as prisoners of war, I wonder, or are they simply treated as criminals and punished to the fullest extent for breaking the host country's laws.
    - eru 5y ago
      > I find it so strange to punish the diplomat in that case rather than the the parent country, — though I assume it will sour relationships. It might have a slight negative impact on relations, but the overall relation between the two countries is much bigger, so relatively it makes less of an impact. In any case, by punishing the individual, they make it harder for the spying country to hire in the future. Especially to hire people with lots of other options. > Are spies in general treated as prisoners of war, I wonder, or are they simply treated as criminals and punished to the fullest extent for breaking the host country's laws. Good question. Google has some hits, eg https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_rul_rule107_sectionb https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_rul... In general, it probably depends on lots of factors.
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ljm 5y ago
Aren't diplomats essentially mutually beneficial spies? They're all working at a higher level than our day to day politics. The Anna Saccoolas debacle between the US and UK is evidence of it, and for Anna and the US it was good. No such luck for Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe, who the same UK government threw under the bus. Because our PM falsely implicated her as a spy in his prior role as foreign minister. My point being - they will make the game work for themselves. The 'good' people are responsible for more evil than criminality can invent. The 'good' people are obsessed with evil. So why are you spying and defending...

That seems awkward. Shouldn’t the British diplomat be spying for Britain?

gruez 5y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_agent https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_agent

ashtonkem 5y ago
The joke is that a diplomat spying on their host country on behalf of their parent country is expected behavior; it’s only awkward if you get caught. There are polite ways of dealing with that, usually by declaring them persona non grata and asking them to leave. Spying on your host country on behalf of someone else though, that gets you arrested.
- Blikkentrekker 5y ago
  I find it so strange to punish the diplomat in that case rather than the the parent country, — though I assume it will sour relationships. I doubt the diplomat had much of a say in it. Are spies in general treated as prisoners of war, I wonder, or are they simply treated as criminals and punished to the fullest extent for breaking the host country's laws.
  - eru 5y ago
    > I find it so strange to punish the diplomat in that case rather than the the parent country, — though I assume it will sour relationships. It might have a slight negative impact on relations, but the overall relation between the two countries is much bigger, so relatively it makes less of an impact. In any case, by punishing the individual, they make it harder for the spying country to hire in the future. Especially to hire people with lots of other options. > Are spies in general treated as prisoners of war, I wonder, or are they simply treated as criminals and punished to the fullest extent for breaking the host country's laws. Good question. Google has some hits, eg https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_rul_rule107_sectionb https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_rul... In general, it probably depends on lots of factors.
  - deleted 5y ago
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ljm 5y ago

Aren't diplomats essentially mutually beneficial spies? They're all working at a higher level than our day to day politics. The Anna Saccoolas debacle between the US and UK is evidence of it, and for Anna and the US it was good. No such luck for Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe, who the same UK government threw under the bus. Because our PM falsely implicated her as a spy in his prior role as foreign minister. My point being - they will make the game work for themselves. The 'good' people are responsible for more evil than criminality can invent. The 'good' people are obsessed with evil. So why are you spying and defending...