5 ms·

Texas House Speaker signs 52 arrest warrants for house Democrats

6 points by Alex3917 5y ago

klodolph 5y ago
Is this news? This is one of the functions of the sergeant-at-arms in legislative bodies, and it happens (as far as I can tell) at times in legislative bodies where one party has a majority, but not a quorum, by themselves. It's another one of those "Oh, those wacky legislators" stories that circulates on a regular basis. It turns out that when we put a bunch of legislators in a room, give them rules to follow, and reward them for advancing their political agenda, they'll manipulate the rules in order to advance their political agenda. Who knew? Here is a story from Oregon in 2019, with some examples from earlier in history... https://www.kezi.com/content/news/Oregon-Senate-officials-search-for-Republicans-for-quorum-509866671.html https://www.kezi.com/content/news/Oregon-Senate-officials-se... > The tactic by the minority Republicans is rare in Oregon, but has been used throughout history, sometimes creating comical scenes. Abraham Lincoln once leapt out of a window in an attempt to deny a quorum when he was a lawmaker in Illinois. In Washington three decades ago, U.S. Sen. Bob Packwood (R-Oregon) was carried feet first into the Senate chamber after Democrats ordered the arrest of Republican senators who were denying a quorum. "Arrest warrant" sounds extreme, but the arrest comes with no consequences other than the arrest itself, and is a public spectacle which both parties engage in. They willingly play both parts. It's not the absentee Democrats are going to be charged with a crime! They're just getting arrested to force them to come to the legislature. Both parties play this farce as the majority party, sending the sergeant-at-arms, and both parties play this farce as the minority party, hiding out at home or even other states to deny quorum to the majority party. Missing from the article is any discussion over the reasons that Democrats are trying to stop progress in the Texas house. Usually, there is some issue... maybe it's the mask mandate ban in Texas, maybe it's something else.
- lax4ever 5y ago
  No, it's really not news. You are right in that arrest warrant does sound extreme. I have heard it called a "Civil Arrest" which doesn't really sound any better but was explained as basically the legal ability to escort these individuals to their place of work. From my understanding it is voting legislation that they oppose which is why they left.
  - t0mbstone 5y ago
    Then they should vote against it instead of hiding. If that's not sufficient, then there is something broken in the political machine.
    - klodolph 5y ago
      I'm not sure it's so "broken". The consequences of breaking a rule are just that you have to... deal with the consequences of breaking that rule. To the extent that that rule has consequences, and the consequences are enforced. Like, if you stop showing up at your job because you disagree with the labor conditions, you get fired. But if everyone in the factory stops showing up at their job, it's suddenly called a "strike" and the apparatus for punishment doesn't work any more... maybe this time, the consequences for the same action are "you get a raise and better healthcare". The rules for legislative bodies generally allow legislators to take more and more extreme actions to influence which laws get passed. As legislators take more extreme actions, the consequences get correspondingly more severe. This seems like "functioning as intended" to me. The absentee legislators have skin in the game... it's not like they can freely walk away from the legislature whenever they disagree with a law. Just like a striking factory worker can freely walk away from their job at the factory and go on strike. These more extreme actions fizzle out, force the other side to reach a compromise, or backfire. The idea that people "should" just sit down and talk things out doesn't scan, IMO. These people are accountable to the people who elected them first, and the legislative body second.
    - lax4ever 5y ago
      I also don't think the system is broken. Yes, absolutely they should be voting against it. That is their prerogative, even duty, as elected members of a representative republic. However, for every vote there are going to be people who agree and people who disagree and both sides are accountable to the people who voted them in. The system is not broken when everyone does their job, regardless of the yay/nay count on a vote. The system breaks when those elected refuse to do the job that they were elected to do.
      - salawat 5y ago
- chomp 5y ago
  No it's not news, it's prescribed by the state constitution, and it's an arrest to deliver them to the legislature. They don't go to jail.
underseacables 5y ago
I used to be really torn about this, but a person is elected to do their job, and I think enough is enough. You don’t like what the majority is doing, fine, I get that but sticking your hand in the sand and abdicating your responsibility to the legislature is just wrong. I think the legislators should be given a chance to come back, and if they don’t, expel them.
- klodolph 5y ago
  I would like to think that the legislators have a responsibility to the people who elected them, which is more important than their responsibility to the legislature.
  - underseacables 5y ago
    So you agree they should be at work instead of on vacation.
    - klodolph 5y ago
      That's a super disingenuous way to argue. It only really works at getting people mad, and it's not even very good at that.
  - krapp 5y ago
    The people like to see shows of defiance, which is all this is. Republicans have done it several times as well.

6 points by Alex3917 5y ago

Is this news? This is one of the functions of the sergeant-at-arms in legislative bodies, and it happens (as far as I can tell) at times in legislative bodies where one party has a majority, but not a quorum, by themselves. It's another one of those "Oh, those wacky legislators" stories that circulates on a regular basis. It turns out that when we put a bunch of legislators in a room, give them rules to follow, and reward them for advancing their political agenda, they'll manipulate the rules in order to advance their political agenda. Who knew? Here is a story from Oregon in 2019, with some examples from earlier in history... https://www.kezi.com/content/news/Oregon-Senate-officials-search-for-Republicans-for-quorum-509866671.html https://www.kezi.com/content/news/Oregon-Senate-officials-se... > The tactic by the minority Republicans is rare in Oregon, but has been used throughout history, sometimes creating comical scenes. Abraham Lincoln once leapt out of a window in an attempt to deny a quorum when he was a lawmaker in Illinois. In Washington three decades ago, U.S. Sen. Bob Packwood (R-Oregon) was carried feet first into the Senate chamber after Democrats ordered the arrest of Republican senators who were denying a quorum. "Arrest warrant" sounds extreme, but the arrest comes with no consequences other than the arrest itself, and is a public spectacle which both parties engage in. They willingly play both parts. It's not the absentee Democrats are going to be charged with a crime! They're just getting arrested to force them to come to the legislature. Both parties play this farce as the majority party, sending the sergeant-at-arms, and both parties play this farce as the minority party, hiding out at home or even other states to deny quorum to the majority party. Missing from the article is any discussion over the reasons that Democrats are trying to stop progress in the Texas house. Usually, there is some issue... maybe it's the mask mandate ban in Texas, maybe it's something else.

lax4ever 5y ago
No, it's really not news. You are right in that arrest warrant does sound extreme. I have heard it called a "Civil Arrest" which doesn't really sound any better but was explained as basically the legal ability to escort these individuals to their place of work. From my understanding it is voting legislation that they oppose which is why they left.
- t0mbstone 5y ago
  Then they should vote against it instead of hiding. If that's not sufficient, then there is something broken in the political machine.
  - klodolph 5y ago
    I'm not sure it's so "broken". The consequences of breaking a rule are just that you have to... deal with the consequences of breaking that rule. To the extent that that rule has consequences, and the consequences are enforced. Like, if you stop showing up at your job because you disagree with the labor conditions, you get fired. But if everyone in the factory stops showing up at their job, it's suddenly called a "strike" and the apparatus for punishment doesn't work any more... maybe this time, the consequences for the same action are "you get a raise and better healthcare". The rules for legislative bodies generally allow legislators to take more and more extreme actions to influence which laws get passed. As legislators take more extreme actions, the consequences get correspondingly more severe. This seems like "functioning as intended" to me. The absentee legislators have skin in the game... it's not like they can freely walk away from the legislature whenever they disagree with a law. Just like a striking factory worker can freely walk away from their job at the factory and go on strike. These more extreme actions fizzle out, force the other side to reach a compromise, or backfire. The idea that people "should" just sit down and talk things out doesn't scan, IMO. These people are accountable to the people who elected them first, and the legislative body second.
  - lax4ever 5y ago
    I also don't think the system is broken. Yes, absolutely they should be voting against it. That is their prerogative, even duty, as elected members of a representative republic. However, for every vote there are going to be people who agree and people who disagree and both sides are accountable to the people who voted them in. The system is not broken when everyone does their job, regardless of the yay/nay count on a vote. The system breaks when those elected refuse to do the job that they were elected to do.
    - salawat 5y ago
chomp 5y ago
No it's not news, it's prescribed by the state constitution, and it's an arrest to deliver them to the legislature. They don't go to jail.

underseacables 5y ago

I used to be really torn about this, but a person is elected to do their job, and I think enough is enough. You don’t like what the majority is doing, fine, I get that but sticking your hand in the sand and abdicating your responsibility to the legislature is just wrong. I think the legislators should be given a chance to come back, and if they don’t, expel them.

klodolph 5y ago
I would like to think that the legislators have a responsibility to the people who elected them, which is more important than their responsibility to the legislature.
- underseacables 5y ago
  So you agree they should be at work instead of on vacation.
  - klodolph 5y ago
    That's a super disingenuous way to argue. It only really works at getting people mad, and it's not even very good at that.
- krapp 5y ago
  The people like to see shows of defiance, which is all this is. Republicans have done it several times as well.