9 ms·

The article estimates the value of the house as 652k USD. That is about 470k GBP. A working-class couple earning the average UK salary (31.5k GBP) could concei

The article estimates the value of the house as 652k USD. That is about 470k GBP. A working-class couple earning the average UK salary (31.5k GBP) could conceivably afford that with a 4.5x salary mortgage if they save 5-10 years for the deposit. It would be enough for a 5-bedroom house in most places in the UK outside London. It is not a guarantee and they could be facing other costs that prevent them from saving up, but it is also not necessarily out of reach.

UncleMeat 5y ago
If you have to save 5-10 years for the deposit, you can't afford the house in a meaningful sense. "It is literally possible for them to risk their finances with a huge loan on a mortgage they will struggle to pay if anything goes wrong" is not really the same thing.
- joshuaissac 5y ago
  > If you have to save 5-10 years for the deposit, you can't afford the house in a meaningful sense In the UK, people are already having to save for 8-10 years for their deposits. The difference is that for a £470k house, a couple on an average salary will have to save more each month (by aggressively cutting expenses). It may not be acceptable in some countries to wait for so long, and many people may find the lifestyle sacrifices not worth it. Even for those prepared to go through with it, > "It is literally possible for them to risk their finances with a huge loan on a mortgage they will struggle to pay if anything goes wrong" is not really the same thing. That is not what I said or even implied. The monthly mortgage repayments a 5-bedroom house will most likely be cheaper than rent on even a smaller house, so the couple should be able to still build up an emergency reserve. The hardest part is getting the deposit together, which takes sustained discipline over a long period of time living below their means while everyone else is living it up, and can still be disrupted by life events (job loss, family needs, etc.). Only some working-class people earn wages that are high enough to do this. But once they have the house, not having to pay rent anymore will actually increase their disposable income, not even considering possibility of renting out the house if they face financial difficulties.
- Kluny 5y ago
  Such a defeatist attitude. I saved for my down payment for 17 years - because I started when I was 15. It wasn't much of a hardship because my lifestyle didn't need a house before that. And it was just normal, 100-400 per month when I happened to have a job (which was probably only half of that time).
handrous 5y ago
Cities (usually, but not always, smallish 4th-tier sorts of cities, like Omaha—no dig intended, I actually like Omaha quite a bit) with huge, nice-looking houses at shockingly low prices in the US exist because the jobs there pay like shit, so there aren't many locals competing for them. There are tons of cities like this where a half-million to $750k can buy you something that's practically an honest-to-god mansion, and isn't even falling apart. (you can do even better out in certain truly rural largish towns, but... well, see below, and imagine all the down-sides are significantly worse, and you've got the idea) "But I work remotely, so this sounds great!" Yes, but your best options for education for your kids will likely be a not-even-that-good (probably Catholic, from what I've seen in these cities) private school (there will likely not be multiple even-decent private options, just the one, though there may be other bad private options) because the local public schools are fairly poor. If any public school district in the area is at all good, decent chance it only covers an area with overpriced new-build McMansions, not the beautiful well-tended 40s-construction budget-tier Queen Anne style mansion with the incredible landscaping, that you had your heart set on. If you ever need/want local employment and you're not a doctor, lawyer, or high-tier manager (or maybe car lot owner), you're screwed (software developer? LOL, hope you like $65k/yr to sling PHP for an abusive manager while your hair prematurely greys and falls out). Also, few of these types of cities exist in places with nice outdoor environments and/or weather (those tend to see prices driven up by vacation homes and tourist activity). IOW it's not valued that way because it's not an extremely nice house for that city. That's standard ultra-rich (by local standards) housing prices in those cities. The prices are that low because so very few people locally make enough money to afford that kind of house.
- rootsudo 5y ago
  100%, this defines alot of Florida to a T.
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  It's not that the jobs and pay in Omaha (or wherever) are shit. It's that there's no money printer industry like tech or high finance dumping stupid amounts of money into the local economy causing a bidding war between the direct beneficiaries and a rat race between everyone else trying to "make their cut".

UncleMeat 5y ago

If you have to save 5-10 years for the deposit, you can't afford the house in a meaningful sense. "It is literally possible for them to risk their finances with a huge loan on a mortgage they will struggle to pay if anything goes wrong" is not really the same thing.

joshuaissac 5y ago
> If you have to save 5-10 years for the deposit, you can't afford the house in a meaningful sense In the UK, people are already having to save for 8-10 years for their deposits. The difference is that for a £470k house, a couple on an average salary will have to save more each month (by aggressively cutting expenses). It may not be acceptable in some countries to wait for so long, and many people may find the lifestyle sacrifices not worth it. Even for those prepared to go through with it, > "It is literally possible for them to risk their finances with a huge loan on a mortgage they will struggle to pay if anything goes wrong" is not really the same thing. That is not what I said or even implied. The monthly mortgage repayments a 5-bedroom house will most likely be cheaper than rent on even a smaller house, so the couple should be able to still build up an emergency reserve. The hardest part is getting the deposit together, which takes sustained discipline over a long period of time living below their means while everyone else is living it up, and can still be disrupted by life events (job loss, family needs, etc.). Only some working-class people earn wages that are high enough to do this. But once they have the house, not having to pay rent anymore will actually increase their disposable income, not even considering possibility of renting out the house if they face financial difficulties.
Kluny 5y ago
Such a defeatist attitude. I saved for my down payment for 17 years - because I started when I was 15. It wasn't much of a hardship because my lifestyle didn't need a house before that. And it was just normal, 100-400 per month when I happened to have a job (which was probably only half of that time).

handrous 5y ago

Cities (usually, but not always, smallish 4th-tier sorts of cities, like Omaha—no dig intended, I actually like Omaha quite a bit) with huge, nice-looking houses at shockingly low prices in the US exist because the jobs there pay like shit, so there aren't many locals competing for them. There are tons of cities like this where a half-million to $750k can buy you something that's practically an honest-to-god mansion, and isn't even falling apart. (you can do even better out in certain truly rural largish towns, but... well, see below, and imagine all the down-sides are significantly worse, and you've got the idea) "But I work remotely, so this sounds great!" Yes, but your best options for education for your kids will likely be a not-even-that-good (probably Catholic, from what I've seen in these cities) private school (there will likely not be multiple even-decent private options, just the one, though there may be other bad private options) because the local public schools are fairly poor. If any public school district in the area is at all good, decent chance it only covers an area with overpriced new-build McMansions, not the beautiful well-tended 40s-construction budget-tier Queen Anne style mansion with the incredible landscaping, that you had your heart set on. If you ever need/want local employment and you're not a doctor, lawyer, or high-tier manager (or maybe car lot owner), you're screwed (software developer? LOL, hope you like $65k/yr to sling PHP for an abusive manager while your hair prematurely greys and falls out). Also, few of these types of cities exist in places with nice outdoor environments and/or weather (those tend to see prices driven up by vacation homes and tourist activity). IOW it's not valued that way because it's not an extremely nice house for that city. That's standard ultra-rich (by local standards) housing prices in those cities. The prices are that low because so very few people locally make enough money to afford that kind of house.

rootsudo 5y ago
100%, this defines alot of Florida to a T.
throwaway0a5e 5y ago
It's not that the jobs and pay in Omaha (or wherever) are shit. It's that there's no money printer industry like tech or high finance dumping stupid amounts of money into the local economy causing a bidding war between the direct beneficiaries and a rat race between everyone else trying to "make their cut".