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> Tech Empower web framework benchmarks, but -- across a battery of tests -- one may clearly discern that there are NO python or ruby frameworks in the top 75%

by slezyr 5y ago

> Tech Empower web framework benchmarks, but -- across a battery of tests -- one may clearly discern that there are NO python or ruby frameworks in the top 75% performing web frameworks yet plenty of go, Java, and PHP frameworks there. Have you seen the source code for the Django app there and one of the top performers? The Django app is just a simple example any developer would write. While Rust's top performers are full of hacks like checking the N-th letter of the HTTP method, no other person would use it in daily life.

maverwa 5y ago
While what you say is true, I don’t see how this invalidates the thesis of the parent comment. Two examples do not invalidate the general trend there. If, however, all implementations are flawed like that, we are having a different problem, right? But yes, super-optimized cases should be removed or marked as such.
- slezyr 5y ago
  > If you (or your company) are paying cloud fees for hosting your services (including serverless), you are absolutely throwing money away, perhaps for a "good" reason ('we have a huge rails codebase'), if you ignore this information. No one "throws away money" based on the Tech Empower benchmark. Because many of those optimizations are not free and, often, are not available. Such micro-optimizations are present in every program. This benchmark is just noise at this point and should be used as an argument against any framework/language. https://github.com/TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks/blob/master/frameworks/C%2B%2B/drogon/drogon_benchmark/plugins/SyncPlugin.cc#L21 https://github.com/TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks/blob/mast...
ezekiel68 5y ago
This is a common claim -- but no one has yet provided any evidence to back it up. So I got curious and took a look in the TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks repo up on github. For the top rust frameworks (actix and ntex), the submissions are surprisingly short and easily comprehendable. Those two, at least, don't pull anything particularly tricky other than perhaps caching the initial portion of a successful HTTP response string (they all do that). By the same token, there has not been any evidence I have seen to support the claim that the scripting language frameworks have not also done their best with their submissions.

by slezyr 5y ago

maverwa 5y ago

While what you say is true, I don’t see how this invalidates the thesis of the parent comment. Two examples do not invalidate the general trend there. If, however, all implementations are flawed like that, we are having a different problem, right? But yes, super-optimized cases should be removed or marked as such.

slezyr 5y ago
> If you (or your company) are paying cloud fees for hosting your services (including serverless), you are absolutely throwing money away, perhaps for a "good" reason ('we have a huge rails codebase'), if you ignore this information. No one "throws away money" based on the Tech Empower benchmark. Because many of those optimizations are not free and, often, are not available. Such micro-optimizations are present in every program. This benchmark is just noise at this point and should be used as an argument against any framework/language. https://github.com/TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks/blob/master/frameworks/C%2B%2B/drogon/drogon_benchmark/plugins/SyncPlugin.cc#L21 https://github.com/TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks/blob/mast...

ezekiel68 5y ago

This is a common claim -- but no one has yet provided any evidence to back it up. So I got curious and took a look in the TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks repo up on github. For the top rust frameworks (actix and ntex), the submissions are surprisingly short and easily comprehendable. Those two, at least, don't pull anything particularly tricky other than perhaps caching the initial portion of a successful HTTP response string (they all do that). By the same token, there has not been any evidence I have seen to support the claim that the scripting language frameworks have not also done their best with their submissions.