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> None of this was enough to crush the virus. Why? Because systems are made of individuals who will decide whether or not they want to collaborate on solving a

> None of this was enough to crush the virus. Why? Because systems are made of individuals who will decide whether or not they want to collaborate on solving a problem. Many of the individuals currently refusing vaccines in the US didn't just decide, there was an active effort made to convince them not to get one: > Had the US continued to vaccinate in the summer at the same rate as in the spring, the US would be near herd immunity by now. It took a lot of work by powerful people and institutions to prevent that outcome. It didn't just *happen.* It was *done.* * https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1416215130656882688 https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1416215130656882688 > COVID vaccine refusal was not some unprompted, spontaneous reaction among pro-Trump Americans. It was manufactured: first as part of a larger program of denial to cover for Trump's pandemic failures; then after Trump lost, in order to stoke feelings of victimhood and persecution. * https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1416408864027824131 https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1416408864027824131 People think that either (a) COVID itself is a hoax or not that bad, or (b) that the vaccines are a hoax: * https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57958358 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57958358 * https://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/2021/07/23/alabama-family-urges-vaccine-after-28-year-old-dies-covid-brytney-cobia-grandview-hospital/7995947002/ https://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/news/2021/07/23/a... These beliefs are highly correlated with where you sit on the political spectrum in the US, and probably your primary news sources.

usaar333 5y ago
> Had the US continued to vaccinate in the summer at the same rate as in the spring, the US would be near herd immunity by now. This obsession in the media with herd immunity is strange. It's not even clear herd immunity with Delta and our current vaccines is attainable. Just look at Iceland where 65+% of cases are fully vaccinated (https://www.covid.is/data https://www.covid.is/data). UK has had high vaccination rates and is still surging (https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/ https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/). We can certainly make the pandemic manageable - I'm not worried about hospitals toppling over in the Bay Area with its 80+% 12+ fully vaccinated rate, but covid is still on the upswing. > People think that either (a) COVID itself is a hoax or not that bad, or (b) that the vaccines are a hoax Granted this is the Bay Area I'm in but the folks I know that refuse to take a vaccine don't see it as a hoax. They are some combination of unconvinced of a low risk of long-term vaccine side-effects (by virtue of us having no actual long-term observations) and concluding P(risk_of_getting_covid) * expected_cost(covid | infected) < expected_cost(side_effects) For some other analysis that this is more than just politics: https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/31/whos-against-the-jab https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/31/whos-agai... https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/27/americas-vaccination-woes-cannot-be-blamed-only-on-politics https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/27/americas-...
- bananabreakfast 5y ago
  You have to admit that those unconvinced people doing that equation are unbelievably selfish, as they are certainly not including the cost of spreading COVID to an immunocompromised person in that last term. The question being asked is "would you take a vaccine to save a neighbor's life?" and these people are answering no.
axguscbklp 5y ago
There was an effort to convince people not to vaccinate, but I think the bigger cause of anti-vaccination sentiment was contrarianism against and distrust of the effort to convince people to vaccinate. Years of government and media lies ranging from the Iraq War to distorted and propagandistic reporting of things that Trump had said resulted in millions of people justifiably feeling that the mainstream media, the government establishment, and the supposed "experts" that the media and government often trot out are all to be distrusted. It is a boy who cried wolf scenario.

usaar333 5y ago

> Had the US continued to vaccinate in the summer at the same rate as in the spring, the US would be near herd immunity by now. This obsession in the media with herd immunity is strange. It's not even clear herd immunity with Delta and our current vaccines is attainable. Just look at Iceland where 65+% of cases are fully vaccinated (https://www.covid.is/data https://www.covid.is/data). UK has had high vaccination rates and is still surging (https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/ https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/). We can certainly make the pandemic manageable - I'm not worried about hospitals toppling over in the Bay Area with its 80+% 12+ fully vaccinated rate, but covid is still on the upswing. > People think that either (a) COVID itself is a hoax or not that bad, or (b) that the vaccines are a hoax Granted this is the Bay Area I'm in but the folks I know that refuse to take a vaccine don't see it as a hoax. They are some combination of unconvinced of a low risk of long-term vaccine side-effects (by virtue of us having no actual long-term observations) and concluding P(risk_of_getting_covid) * expected_cost(covid | infected) < expected_cost(side_effects) For some other analysis that this is more than just politics: https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/31/whos-against-the-jab https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/31/whos-agai... https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/27/americas-vaccination-woes-cannot-be-blamed-only-on-politics https://www.economist.com/united-states/2021/07/27/americas-...

bananabreakfast 5y ago
You have to admit that those unconvinced people doing that equation are unbelievably selfish, as they are certainly not including the cost of spreading COVID to an immunocompromised person in that last term. The question being asked is "would you take a vaccine to save a neighbor's life?" and these people are answering no.

axguscbklp 5y ago

There was an effort to convince people not to vaccinate, but I think the bigger cause of anti-vaccination sentiment was contrarianism against and distrust of the effort to convince people to vaccinate. Years of government and media lies ranging from the Iraq War to distorted and propagandistic reporting of things that Trump had said resulted in millions of people justifiably feeling that the mainstream media, the government establishment, and the supposed "experts" that the media and government often trot out are all to be distrusted. It is a boy who cried wolf scenario.