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There was parents arrested over bath time and playing in the yard sprinklers, photos being processed at photo mats, will the same thing happen by apple mistaken
by IronWolve 5y ago
There was parents arrested over bath time and playing in the yard sprinklers, photos being processed at photo mats, will the same thing happen by apple mistakenly reporting parents?
When I worked telecom, we had md5sum database to check for this type of content. If you emailed/sms/uploaded a file with the same md5sum, your account was flagged and sent to legal to confirm it.
Also if a police was involved, the account was burned to dvd in the datacenter, and only a police officer would touch the dvd, no engineer touched or saw the evidence. (Chain of Evidence maintained)
Prob changed since I haven't worked in telecom in 15 years, but one thing I've read for years, is the feds knew who these people are, where they hang out online, even ran the some of the honeypots. The problem is they leave these sites up to catch the ring leaders, the feds are aware, they have busts almost every month of rings of criminals. Twitter has had accounts reported, and they stay up for years.
I dont think finding the criminals are the problem, seems like every time this happens, theres been people of interest for years, just not enough law enforcement dedicated to investigating this.
All the defund the police, I think moving some police from traffic duty to Internet crimes would be more of an impact on actual cases being closed. Those crimes lead to racketeering and other organized crime anyways.
- jolux 5y ago> There was parents arrested over bath time and playing in the yard sprinklers, photos being processed at photo mats, will the same thing happen by apple mistakenly reporting parents? No, because they’re not identifying content, they’re matching it against a set of already-known CSAM that NCMEC maintains. As you go on to say, telecoms and other companies already do this. Apple just advanced the state of the art when it comes to the security and privacy guarantees involved.
- XorNot 5y agoIt's a lossy hash match though. If it wasn't, then subtly re-encoding the image would hide it. So they're definitely going to be mistakingly matching images.
- robertoandred 5y agoAnd any mistakes would be caught by the manual review.
- vorpalhex 5y agoSo now Apple gets to paw through your images without a warrant or consent?
- edmundsauto 5y agoWhich will have its own rate of false positives. Manual review is not a panacea, especially if the original net is cast widely.
- vorpalhex 5y agoA set of unverified hashes that you hope only came from NCMEC. Telecoms do this on their own devices - not yours. Apple just opened the door for constant searches of your digital devices. If you think it will stop at CSAM you have never read a history book - the single biggest user of UKs camera system originally intended for serious crimes are housing councils checking to see who didn't clean up after their dog.
- jolux 5y ago> A set of unverified hashes that you hope only came from NCMEC. Telecoms do this on their own devices - not yours. Yes, those are the main things we’re concerned about. > Apple just opened the door for constant searches of your digital devices. Specifically, it opens the door to them scanning content which is then end-to-end encrypted, which is the main problem. I think the jury is out on whether this capability will be abused. Apple has said they will reject requests to use it for other purposes, but who really knows whether they will end up being forced to add hashes that aren’t CSAM? I agree that both of these are potential problems.
- vorpalhex 5y agoApple gave up in the face of China. Why not the US too?
- albertgoeswoof 5y ago> the single biggest user of UKs camera system originally intended for serious crimes are housing councils checking to see who didn't clean up after their dog. Which camera system? Do you have a citation for that?
- prawn 5y agoYou can read a bit more about how it would work here: https://daringfireball.net/2021/08/apple_child_safety_initiatives_slippery_slope https://daringfireball.net/2021/08/apple_child_safety_initia... (No, not arresting parents over bath time.)
- vmladenov 5y agoI want to draw attention to one point in this > Will Apple actually flatly refuse any and all such demands? If they do, it’s all good. If they don’t, and these features creep into surveillance for things like political dissent, copyright infringement, LGBT imagery, or adult pornography — anything at all beyond irrefutable CSAM — it’ll prove disastrous to Apple’s reputation for privacy protection. The EFF seems to see such slipping down the slope as inevitable. What seems to be missing from this discussion is that Apple is already doing these scans on the iCloud photos they store. Therefore, the slippery slope scenario is already a threat today. What’s stopping Apple from acquiescing to a government request to scan for political content right now, or in any of the past years iCloud photos has existed? The answer is they claim not to and their customers believe them. Nothing changes when the scanning moves on device, though, as the blog mentions, I suspect this is a precursor to allowing more private data in iCloud backups that Apple cannot decrypt even when ordered to.
- vorpalhex 5y agoThe slippery slope has already been slid down for every iCloud user in China.