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The United States has the world's longest running presidential system, and is the only exception to the rule so far.

by HenryKissinger 5y ago

axiosgunnar 5y ago
Interesting, what might be the reason for its success despite being a presidential system?
- gpt5 5y ago
  The electoral system. It ensures a two party system which makes the government lean center (on both sides) and be very stable.
  - KSteffensen 5y ago
    I used to think the two party system was a major driver in polarization and resulting instability in the USA and UK, but I guess people can refuse to listen to each other in any system (Israel, Italy, Sweden).
- bluedevil2k 5y ago
  Vast natural resources creating wealth for the entire population. (Before anyone says “there’s lots of poor people in America...they are not even close to poor by world standards). When the economy is almost always booming, jobs are plentiful, things are cheap, there’s no reason to overthrow a government. As the famous quote explains, “it’s the economy stupid”.
  - IdiocyInAction 5y ago
    That also applies to Argentina.
- noduerme 5y ago
  It has nothing to do with resources. Per person, Argentina had more land and more natural wealth than the US. The reason our presidential system is less prone to upheaval is the Constitution, its separation of powers and its checks and balances which have, historically, provided for a relatively restrained power of the presidency in the US compared to other presidential systems. Also, the US has what are recently referred to as "norms", precedents set early in the Republic and reinforced through hundreds of years of peaceful transitions of power. These hold a great deal of weight, even now. The political independence of the military, its culture of unwillingness to step into politics, and the taboo on the use of the military for policing on American soil, is another key component in American stability vs the rest of the Americas. Whether this holds up for another 5 years is anyone's guess. My family is from Argentina, and having lived there myself I see the US sliding in that direction. One very telling thing is the increasing justification of political violence that would have been unthinkable a decade ago. However, America has been through periods of political violence before and has not degenerated into a dictatorship, although it's come close.
  - the-dude 5y ago
    > the taboo on the use of the military for policing on American soil Instead, the police militarized. Then there is the National Guard(?).
    - noduerme 5y ago
      The National Guard are under state level control, and the police although "militarized" technologically, are nothing remotely resembling the US military - or even the Argentine military. I brought it up because in almost every country in LatAm the military has at one time or another overthrown the elected government. That hasn't happened in the US. That's a significant problem if a national military begins operating as a police force.
      - the-dude 5y ago
        I don't necessarily disagree with you, just want to add that as a European who lived in the US around 2000 for a while, it feels like a police state from time to time.
        sanedigital 5y ago
        In France, the Gendarmes patrol plazas and parks in full military attire and arms: fully automatic weapons and combat shotguns. The same in Spain and Italy with the Policia Nacional and the Carabineri. That’s unheard of in the US, outside of some spots in NYC or DC.
        noduerme 5y ago
        I lived outside the US from 2004, including in France and Spain from 2009-2014. It definitely feels much less militarized there than in the US. Returning to the US after ten years was absolutely shocking. However, I also lived in countries in Asia and Latin America where the actual military plays a major role in policing and putting down protests. Now I live in Portland, where the militarized local police put down protests, and I can say that the qualitative difference between those situations is that the local police do not represent the government of the country. They still answer to the courts. They can't throw you in a black hole without legal representation. They don't have the true power of the state behind them. They may be fucked up as hell, but they aren't the army, in the sense that the actual military is sent in to suppress uprisings around the world. That was my point about what allowed America to escape the tragic cycle of coups that has befallen most other presidential republics ... the taboo on the military engaging in domestic policing. No other country in Latin America has that taboo, and as a result the army in each county functions as a bludgeon by whoever takes absolute power -- usually fascists, but in odd cases (Venezuela, El Salvador), leftist totalitarians.

The United States has the world's longest running presidential system, and is the only exception to the rule so far.

axiosgunnar 5y ago

Interesting, what might be the reason for its success despite being a presidential system?

gpt5 5y ago
The electoral system. It ensures a two party system which makes the government lean center (on both sides) and be very stable.
- KSteffensen 5y ago
  I used to think the two party system was a major driver in polarization and resulting instability in the USA and UK, but I guess people can refuse to listen to each other in any system (Israel, Italy, Sweden).
bluedevil2k 5y ago
Vast natural resources creating wealth for the entire population. (Before anyone says “there’s lots of poor people in America...they are not even close to poor by world standards). When the economy is almost always booming, jobs are plentiful, things are cheap, there’s no reason to overthrow a government. As the famous quote explains, “it’s the economy stupid”.
- IdiocyInAction 5y ago
  That also applies to Argentina.
noduerme 5y ago
It has nothing to do with resources. Per person, Argentina had more land and more natural wealth than the US. The reason our presidential system is less prone to upheaval is the Constitution, its separation of powers and its checks and balances which have, historically, provided for a relatively restrained power of the presidency in the US compared to other presidential systems. Also, the US has what are recently referred to as "norms", precedents set early in the Republic and reinforced through hundreds of years of peaceful transitions of power. These hold a great deal of weight, even now. The political independence of the military, its culture of unwillingness to step into politics, and the taboo on the use of the military for policing on American soil, is another key component in American stability vs the rest of the Americas. Whether this holds up for another 5 years is anyone's guess. My family is from Argentina, and having lived there myself I see the US sliding in that direction. One very telling thing is the increasing justification of political violence that would have been unthinkable a decade ago. However, America has been through periods of political violence before and has not degenerated into a dictatorship, although it's come close.
- the-dude 5y ago
  > the taboo on the use of the military for policing on American soil Instead, the police militarized. Then there is the National Guard(?).
  - noduerme 5y ago
    The National Guard are under state level control, and the police although "militarized" technologically, are nothing remotely resembling the US military - or even the Argentine military. I brought it up because in almost every country in LatAm the military has at one time or another overthrown the elected government. That hasn't happened in the US. That's a significant problem if a national military begins operating as a police force.
    - the-dude 5y ago
      I don't necessarily disagree with you, just want to add that as a European who lived in the US around 2000 for a while, it feels like a police state from time to time.
      - sanedigital 5y ago
        In France, the Gendarmes patrol plazas and parks in full military attire and arms: fully automatic weapons and combat shotguns. The same in Spain and Italy with the Policia Nacional and the Carabineri. That’s unheard of in the US, outside of some spots in NYC or DC.
      - noduerme 5y ago
        I lived outside the US from 2004, including in France and Spain from 2009-2014. It definitely feels much less militarized there than in the US. Returning to the US after ten years was absolutely shocking. However, I also lived in countries in Asia and Latin America where the actual military plays a major role in policing and putting down protests. Now I live in Portland, where the militarized local police put down protests, and I can say that the qualitative difference between those situations is that the local police do not represent the government of the country. They still answer to the courts. They can't throw you in a black hole without legal representation. They don't have the true power of the state behind them. They may be fucked up as hell, but they aren't the army, in the sense that the actual military is sent in to suppress uprisings around the world. That was my point about what allowed America to escape the tragic cycle of coups that has befallen most other presidential republics ... the taboo on the military engaging in domestic policing. No other country in Latin America has that taboo, and as a result the army in each county functions as a bludgeon by whoever takes absolute power -- usually fascists, but in odd cases (Venezuela, El Salvador), leftist totalitarians.