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WhatsApp is quickly earning back my trust as the most privacy-respecting chat system for laypeople right now. Obviously, actions matter more than words, but th

by shawnz 5y ago

WhatsApp is quickly earning back my trust as the most privacy-respecting chat system for laypeople right now. Obviously, actions matter more than words, but the actions they have been taking as of late are promising. I certainly won't be putting all my eggs in one basket after being burned this many times, but for now I am happy to recommend WhatsApp. See also the recent news about them rolling out encrypted backups, which essentially would solve the biggest weak point with WhatsApp right now: https://www.theverge.com/2021/7/16/22580800/icloud-google-drive-encrypted-whatsapp-cloud-backup https://www.theverge.com/2021/7/16/22580800/icloud-google-dr...

peakaboo 5y ago
You know WhatsApp is Facebook right? I don't think there is a worse company to trust except maybe Google. :)
- shawnz 5y ago
  Didn't Apple just show us how brand names are basically meaningless? I am only concerned with their actions, not their owners.
  - ranguna 5y ago
    WhatsApp's action are pretty bad, did you forget that terms of service change a few months ago? They literally said that WhatsApp will start to share metadata, including your availability, status and the people you talk with, with Facebook companies. Who are you trying to convince? Did Facebook pay you to say this or something?
    - shawnz 5y ago
      I remember the terms of service change and I almost left the platform because of it. But you are also greatly mischaracterizing the change. It actually only allows those things in some pretty specific circumstances which are under the user's control (although that's still not ideal, of course). I am only trying to convince WhatsApp that the stance they are taking here is the right one. Unless we give credit where it's actually due, what will be the incentive for any bigcorp to take any privacy-protecting actions?
  - Talanes 5y ago
    Opposite directions. If you put a clean shirt and a dirty shirt in a bag together, the dirty shirt can rub off it'd dirtiness on the clean one, but the cleanness can't rub off and make the dirty shirt clean.
  - shitRETARDSsay 5y ago
    They make an statement and this guy talks like he has their source code.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
D13Fd 5y ago
I don't think I'm ever going to be able to trust an entity--or a free app--that is ultimately controlled by Facebook.
- ssss11 5y ago
  This ^ Think “Facebook” not “WhatsApp”
  - ChrisArchitect 5y ago
    yeah, my kneejerk reaction to the tweet was "Mark@FB has entered the chat"
whyoh 5y ago
Unencrypted backups are bad, but this is arguably even worse: https://jorislacance.fr/blog/2021/04/16/whatsapp-tracking-2 https://jorislacance.fr/blog/2021/04/16/whatsapp-tracking-2 (Discussion on HN: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26889139 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26889139)
ohthehugemanate 5y ago
Right, they guard the sanctity of your content fiercely. And make enormous bags of money off of your contact list, frequency and timing of contacts, awake timing, location, etc etc. And even if you're in a country (only really Germany AFAIK) where the worst use of metadata for advertising is legally tricky... WhatsApp is the very definition of the fox guarding the henhouse. Do you really trust one of the largest data harvesters andy advertising marketplaces in the world to guard your data? Their business model literally depends on violating that trust. Do you honestly think that's a safe long term bet?
shitRETARDSsay 5y ago
Totally. Facebook and their subsidiaries are the gold-standard for privacy.
bluepizza 5y ago
WhatsApp refuses to take action against misinformation or political spammers. They understand that their products are being used to undermine democracy in the whole of Latin America and they refuse to implement one spam detector. There are large scale implications to these "privacy" features.
dunefox 5y ago
> the most privacy-respecting chat system for laypeople right now. Sorry, but that has to be either Threema or Signal. WhatsApp is easy to use, but that's the only point it has. Ultimately, it's Facebook.

by shawnz 5y ago

peakaboo 5y ago

You know WhatsApp is Facebook right? I don't think there is a worse company to trust except maybe Google. :)

shawnz 5y ago
Didn't Apple just show us how brand names are basically meaningless? I am only concerned with their actions, not their owners.
- ranguna 5y ago
  WhatsApp's action are pretty bad, did you forget that terms of service change a few months ago? They literally said that WhatsApp will start to share metadata, including your availability, status and the people you talk with, with Facebook companies. Who are you trying to convince? Did Facebook pay you to say this or something?
  - shawnz 5y ago
    I remember the terms of service change and I almost left the platform because of it. But you are also greatly mischaracterizing the change. It actually only allows those things in some pretty specific circumstances which are under the user's control (although that's still not ideal, of course). I am only trying to convince WhatsApp that the stance they are taking here is the right one. Unless we give credit where it's actually due, what will be the incentive for any bigcorp to take any privacy-protecting actions?
- Talanes 5y ago
  Opposite directions. If you put a clean shirt and a dirty shirt in a bag together, the dirty shirt can rub off it'd dirtiness on the clean one, but the cleanness can't rub off and make the dirty shirt clean.
- shitRETARDSsay 5y ago
  They make an statement and this guy talks like he has their source code.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

D13Fd 5y ago

I don't think I'm ever going to be able to trust an entity--or a free app--that is ultimately controlled by Facebook.

ssss11 5y ago
This ^ Think “Facebook” not “WhatsApp”
- ChrisArchitect 5y ago
  yeah, my kneejerk reaction to the tweet was "Mark@FB has entered the chat"

whyoh 5y ago

Unencrypted backups are bad, but this is arguably even worse: https://jorislacance.fr/blog/2021/04/16/whatsapp-tracking-2 https://jorislacance.fr/blog/2021/04/16/whatsapp-tracking-2 (Discussion on HN: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26889139 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26889139)

ohthehugemanate 5y ago

Right, they guard the sanctity of your content fiercely. And make enormous bags of money off of your contact list, frequency and timing of contacts, awake timing, location, etc etc. And even if you're in a country (only really Germany AFAIK) where the worst use of metadata for advertising is legally tricky... WhatsApp is the very definition of the fox guarding the henhouse. Do you really trust one of the largest data harvesters andy advertising marketplaces in the world to guard your data? Their business model literally depends on violating that trust. Do you honestly think that's a safe long term bet?

shitRETARDSsay 5y ago

Totally. Facebook and their subsidiaries are the gold-standard for privacy.

bluepizza 5y ago

WhatsApp refuses to take action against misinformation or political spammers. They understand that their products are being used to undermine democracy in the whole of Latin America and they refuse to implement one spam detector. There are large scale implications to these "privacy" features.

dunefox 5y ago

> the most privacy-respecting chat system for laypeople right now. Sorry, but that has to be either Threema or Signal. WhatsApp is easy to use, but that's the only point it has. Ultimately, it's Facebook.