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From https://calyxos.org/about/ https://calyxos.org/about/: > In social science, agency is defined as: the capacity of individuals to act independently and to

From https://calyxos.org/about/ https://calyxos.org/about/: > In social science, agency is defined as: the capacity of individuals to act independently and to make their own free choices. > built-in integration for Signal and WhatsApp calls Signal and WhatsApp are both fully centralised, tied to a single organisation each — they are antithetical to agency. Why not use open protocols like DeltaChat, Matrix or XMPP instead? > built-in free “Virtual Private Network” services from trusted organizations protect you from being spied on Trusted by whom?

spinax 5y ago
> Trusted by whom? Calyx VPN uses the same tech stack as Riseup VPN, which are branded versions of the Bitmask client - CalyxOS is a part of the Calyx Institute family. You can instead use the Bitmask client from the F-Droid repo and choose to connect to either service with the same app (rather than using branded apps for each service).
- steelbrain 5y ago
  Curious, does anyone know what's their business model to monetizing the "free" VPN service? How do they make their money back or is it a donation kind of thing?
  - flylikeabanana 5y ago
    I gave them some money at DEFCON 2019 for an unlimited personal hotspot https://boingboing.net/2016/09/22/i-have-found-a-secret-tunnel-t.html https://boingboing.net/2016/09/22/i-have-found-a-secret-tunn...
  - cdesai 5y ago
    It is all based on donations, see https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn
- edoceo 5y ago
  Well, I don't trust them either. Does it run Wireguard?
- _jal 5y ago
  The tech stack matters far less than the trustworthiness and competence of the operators running it. And the hard part with VPN services is that it is very difficult to prove those things to others.
- grey_earthling 5y ago
  So the organizations that provide the VPN service are Calyx VPN and Calyx Institute (have I understood correctly?) The site says these organizations are “trusted”, but I'm still not sure who are they saying is doing the trusting. It's very easy to label something “trusted”, but trusted by whom?
godelski 5y ago
> Why not use open protocols like DeltaChat, Matrix or XMPP instead? Because Signal and WhatsApp are text/messanger replacements and Matrix is a slack/discord replacement? I'm not sure why there's the constant Signal vs Matrix battle here on HN, I see them as different tools doing different things. I'm not going to create or get all my friends to join a server with Matrix. Or even coworkers or random acquaintances I meet. But I can get their phone number and quickly communicate with them on Signal/WA. I don't see why Signal and Matrix have to be in competition. Just the same way I don't see Slack/Discord in competition with Text Messaging or FB Messenger.
- atatatat 5y ago
  > I don't see why Signal and Matrix have to be in competition Because people here only care about security and privacy, and Signal/Matrix offer some of the best user accessible encryption.
  - godelski 5y ago
    Yeah, I agree, but I don't see why they are in competition and not complement an ecosystem.
    - gefhfff 5y ago
      I don't see why they would complement themselves, and especially why you put Matrix into the slack/discord corner: Matrix is a protocol that is not designed to a specific use case.
cdesai 5y ago
The integration is done in the Dialer, and the choices are shown when you make a phone call to a number. Signal and WhatsApp are choices there since they use phone numbers. How do you make a matrix call to a phone number? :)
cdesai 5y ago
The VPN is one of the Digital Services we offer, completely free. https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn We also include RiseupVPN, and Orbot (which is Tor as a VPN)
barbazoo 5y ago
> Why not use open protocols like DeltaChat, Matrix or XMPP instead? I can give you an answer for Matrix and it's usability. It's difficult to onboard users, at least it was ~a year ago. I wouldn't want to expose my non-tech friends to that.

spinax 5y ago

> Trusted by whom? Calyx VPN uses the same tech stack as Riseup VPN, which are branded versions of the Bitmask client - CalyxOS is a part of the Calyx Institute family. You can instead use the Bitmask client from the F-Droid repo and choose to connect to either service with the same app (rather than using branded apps for each service).

steelbrain 5y ago
Curious, does anyone know what's their business model to monetizing the "free" VPN service? How do they make their money back or is it a donation kind of thing?
- flylikeabanana 5y ago
  I gave them some money at DEFCON 2019 for an unlimited personal hotspot https://boingboing.net/2016/09/22/i-have-found-a-secret-tunnel-t.html https://boingboing.net/2016/09/22/i-have-found-a-secret-tunn...
- cdesai 5y ago
  It is all based on donations, see https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn
edoceo 5y ago
Well, I don't trust them either. Does it run Wireguard?
_jal 5y ago
The tech stack matters far less than the trustworthiness and competence of the operators running it. And the hard part with VPN services is that it is very difficult to prove those things to others.
grey_earthling 5y ago
So the organizations that provide the VPN service are Calyx VPN and Calyx Institute (have I understood correctly?) The site says these organizations are “trusted”, but I'm still not sure who are they saying is doing the trusting. It's very easy to label something “trusted”, but trusted by whom?

godelski 5y ago

> Why not use open protocols like DeltaChat, Matrix or XMPP instead? Because Signal and WhatsApp are text/messanger replacements and Matrix is a slack/discord replacement? I'm not sure why there's the constant Signal vs Matrix battle here on HN, I see them as different tools doing different things. I'm not going to create or get all my friends to join a server with Matrix. Or even coworkers or random acquaintances I meet. But I can get their phone number and quickly communicate with them on Signal/WA. I don't see why Signal and Matrix have to be in competition. Just the same way I don't see Slack/Discord in competition with Text Messaging or FB Messenger.

atatatat 5y ago
> I don't see why Signal and Matrix have to be in competition Because people here only care about security and privacy, and Signal/Matrix offer some of the best user accessible encryption.
- godelski 5y ago
  Yeah, I agree, but I don't see why they are in competition and not complement an ecosystem.
  - gefhfff 5y ago
    I don't see why they would complement themselves, and especially why you put Matrix into the slack/discord corner: Matrix is a protocol that is not designed to a specific use case.

cdesai 5y ago

The integration is done in the Dialer, and the choices are shown when you make a phone call to a number. Signal and WhatsApp are choices there since they use phone numbers. How do you make a matrix call to a phone number? :)

cdesai 5y ago

The VPN is one of the Digital Services we offer, completely free. https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn https://calyxinstitute.org/projects/digital-services/vpn We also include RiseupVPN, and Orbot (which is Tor as a VPN)

barbazoo 5y ago

> Why not use open protocols like DeltaChat, Matrix or XMPP instead? I can give you an answer for Matrix and it's usability. It's difficult to onboard users, at least it was ~a year ago. I wouldn't want to expose my non-tech friends to that.