3 ms·

If we follow this line of thinking, we don't have to go far before we decide to force everyone to do exactly what we _think_ is right, justified by some hand wa

If we follow this line of thinking, we don't have to go far before we decide to force everyone to do exactly what we _think_ is right, justified by some hand wavy science or moral belief. There is disagreement in society; we aren't all drones with a hive mind. One person's justification for what he thinks is best is just that, one person's justification. Someone else might think they can poke holes in his arguments, and who is to say which is right? No one. They can go about doing according to their personal beliefs. There are some conventions in society, but once we start encroaching on the gray area, then society becomes oppressive to the minorities who dissent. Our society can clearly see older societies that did it, but fail to see when they are doing it. Just because you think you are absolutely right doesn't mean you have the right to compel others to do it. And, just consider, you might just be wrong... but of course not, our society is so enlightened, it couldn't be wrong...

criticaltinker 5y ago
Well put and I couldn't agree more that diversity is essential for robust and fair ecosystems. > And, just consider, you might just be wrong And it's okay to be wrong, so long as one keeps an open mind and considers all the available evidence. For example, consider that people who have been infected and recovered have robust and durable immunity that is proving to be at least equally as effective as vaccination [1][2]. It would be a waste to force these people to be vaccinated, especially when there are many other people who would greatly benefit from those doses (eg in developing countries with limited access to modern healthcare facilities). [1] SARS-CoV-2 infection induces long-lived bone marrow plasma cells in humans https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4.pdf https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4.pdf [2] Necessity of COVID-19 vaccination in previously infected individuals https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v3.full.pdf https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v...
- native_samples 5y ago
  Well, it's a lot more than a waste. Recall that mRNA vaccines work by forcing your cells to produce spike protein, which is then detected as an infection leading to those cells being damaged or destroyed by the immune system. If you have already fought off COVID then being injected with the vaccine can only damage your body. It cannot help because you are already immune. And it's not the case that your pre-existing immunity means less damage: it means more, because when your body has never seen the spike protein before it has to build its own immune response in parallel to the mRNA particles degrading and the spike protein manufacturing falling away. The effect of the vaccine doesn't last long so by the time the immune system is fully ramped up the spikes aren't being made much anymore anyway. But if you are fully immune already, then your immune system can start destroying the mRNA 'infected' cells immediately, so far more will end up being attacked. The more you investigate exactly how these mRNA vaccines work, the more questions are raised. And unfortunately there are remarkably few answers out there in the literature.

criticaltinker 5y ago

Well put and I couldn't agree more that diversity is essential for robust and fair ecosystems. > And, just consider, you might just be wrong And it's okay to be wrong, so long as one keeps an open mind and considers all the available evidence. For example, consider that people who have been infected and recovered have robust and durable immunity that is proving to be at least equally as effective as vaccination [1][2]. It would be a waste to force these people to be vaccinated, especially when there are many other people who would greatly benefit from those doses (eg in developing countries with limited access to modern healthcare facilities). [1] SARS-CoV-2 infection induces long-lived bone marrow plasma cells in humans https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4.pdf https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4.pdf [2] Necessity of COVID-19 vaccination in previously infected individuals https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v3.full.pdf https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v...

native_samples 5y ago
Well, it's a lot more than a waste. Recall that mRNA vaccines work by forcing your cells to produce spike protein, which is then detected as an infection leading to those cells being damaged or destroyed by the immune system. If you have already fought off COVID then being injected with the vaccine can only damage your body. It cannot help because you are already immune. And it's not the case that your pre-existing immunity means less damage: it means more, because when your body has never seen the spike protein before it has to build its own immune response in parallel to the mRNA particles degrading and the spike protein manufacturing falling away. The effect of the vaccine doesn't last long so by the time the immune system is fully ramped up the spikes aren't being made much anymore anyway. But if you are fully immune already, then your immune system can start destroying the mRNA 'infected' cells immediately, so far more will end up being attacked. The more you investigate exactly how these mRNA vaccines work, the more questions are raised. And unfortunately there are remarkably few answers out there in the literature.