3 ms·

It is awful - I'm glad you never had to deal with. It provides little revenue and causes a huge amount of hassle and makes living overseas way more difficult.

ricksunny 5y ago
American expat here - agreed with the other expats - it’s the filing that really, really sucks. Like really. Breaking the difficulty down in terms of priority. 1 - just trying to work through what all might possibly be owed and not owed to US as well as the country(ies) one operates in. 2 - Identifying through which paperwork to declare it, while also ensuring income / business reporting is copacetic with the tax regime of the country that same is actually earned in. As a business owner, (many operating overseas are looking after a business) I have to complete corporate accounts (which costs $$$$ and takes forever) before I can file American income tax for the same accounting year. 3 - the value of the tax liability itself is a distant third in terms of hassle than any of the above. (I’ll include in this bucket the fact that Americans are taxed on income earned abroad, putting us at enormous disadvantage for work opportunities vis—a-vis peer expats who come from other countries)
- 1024core 5y ago
  Why doesn't the US reduce it to a flat tax? Say, $1000/year to send you your election ballot, and evacuate you in case something goes horribly wrong.
  - javert 5y ago
    The US government doesn't work like that. There isn't some logical person making logical decisions. For this change to occur, many senators and representatives would have to be directly and personally incentivized to make the change. They aren't.
    - mbg721 5y ago
      Moreover, they're incentivized to do the opposite. Expats aren't a sympathetic group to any major voting demographic.
  - kingosticks 5y ago
    And how about they make this service opt-in. I was born in the US but I have had nothing to do with the place for 95% of my life and I don't want their help. Why must I fill out their paperwork every year or pay them money to opt-out (which I can't even do anymore because of the current backlog).
emodendroket 5y ago
Perhaps the revenue is not very great but if there were a blanket exception I think you’d suddenly find a lot more people gaming then system to not technically be US residents and thereby escape large amounts of liability.
- ElFitz 5y ago
  Most countries don’t tax citizens living abroad on foreign revenue, and just forget about them once they become residents elsewhere (unless they still have income from their country of origin).
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - robin_reala 5y ago
    And by most here, you mean every single country in the world apart from the US, Eritrea, Myanmar and Hungary.
    - randomchars 5y ago
      Hungary does not tax it's citizens living abroad.
      - robin_reala 5y ago
        I was going by the table at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_taxation#Individuals https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_taxation#Individ... but it’s entirely possible that it’s incorrect.
        naniwaduni 5y ago
        It looks like Hungary technically taxes nonresident citizens except in almost every case where it would matter.
- 5y ago

ricksunny 5y ago

American expat here - agreed with the other expats - it’s the filing that really, really sucks. Like really. Breaking the difficulty down in terms of priority. 1 - just trying to work through what all might possibly be owed and not owed to US as well as the country(ies) one operates in. 2 - Identifying through which paperwork to declare it, while also ensuring income / business reporting is copacetic with the tax regime of the country that same is actually earned in. As a business owner, (many operating overseas are looking after a business) I have to complete corporate accounts (which costs $$$$ and takes forever) before I can file American income tax for the same accounting year. 3 - the value of the tax liability itself is a distant third in terms of hassle than any of the above. (I’ll include in this bucket the fact that Americans are taxed on income earned abroad, putting us at enormous disadvantage for work opportunities vis—a-vis peer expats who come from other countries)

1024core 5y ago
Why doesn't the US reduce it to a flat tax? Say, $1000/year to send you your election ballot, and evacuate you in case something goes horribly wrong.
- javert 5y ago
  The US government doesn't work like that. There isn't some logical person making logical decisions. For this change to occur, many senators and representatives would have to be directly and personally incentivized to make the change. They aren't.
  - mbg721 5y ago
    Moreover, they're incentivized to do the opposite. Expats aren't a sympathetic group to any major voting demographic.
- kingosticks 5y ago
  And how about they make this service opt-in. I was born in the US but I have had nothing to do with the place for 95% of my life and I don't want their help. Why must I fill out their paperwork every year or pay them money to opt-out (which I can't even do anymore because of the current backlog).

emodendroket 5y ago

Perhaps the revenue is not very great but if there were a blanket exception I think you’d suddenly find a lot more people gaming then system to not technically be US residents and thereby escape large amounts of liability.

ElFitz 5y ago
Most countries don’t tax citizens living abroad on foreign revenue, and just forget about them once they become residents elsewhere (unless they still have income from their country of origin).
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- robin_reala 5y ago
  And by most here, you mean every single country in the world apart from the US, Eritrea, Myanmar and Hungary.
  - randomchars 5y ago
    Hungary does not tax it's citizens living abroad.
    - robin_reala 5y ago
      I was going by the table at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_taxation#Individuals https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_taxation#Individ... but it’s entirely possible that it’s incorrect.
      - naniwaduni 5y ago
        It looks like Hungary technically taxes nonresident citizens except in almost every case where it would matter.
5y ago