5 ms·

This is no different from Miami printing dollars no? How is this legal?

by sprafa 5y ago

zepto 5y ago
This is no different from Miami selling numbered prints of an artwork. How is it not legal?
- sprafa 5y ago
  An artwork? Well, maybe.
- elliekelly 5y ago
  Which begs an interesting question: could a city selling of numbered prints of artwork ever be an "investment contract" under Howey[1]? I think perhaps yes. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEC_v._W._J._Howey_Co https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEC_v._W._J._Howey_Co.
JumpCrisscross 5y ago
> This is no different from Miami printing dollars no? How is this legal? Is there a prohibition on states printing money?
- Veliladon 5y ago
  Literally Article I, Section 10 of the Constitution. No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.
  - ddalex 5y ago
    > make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts Since the dollar is not pegged to a gold or silver standard, I'd say the ship of this section has already sailed.
    - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
      These are limits on the states, not the federal government [1]. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_Tender_Cases https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_Tender_Cases
  - kktkti9 5y ago
    I suppose since we use paper bills, and debit cards, most states are violating the “make any Thing but gold and silver…” bit. Pretty sure the only bits in that doc taken seriously are the lack of rules against meddling in elections, and leveraging 1A and 2A to rile the masses.
    - taejo 5y ago
      Paper bills are issued by the Federal Reserve Banks, not the states. Debit cards aren't "Tender in Payment of Debts" at all: creditors don't have to accept payment by debit card.
      - kktkti9 5y ago
        Creditors CAN accept them because states do not disallow it. The point is taking the language in that document literally is a ridiculous exercise. The men that wrote it had barely discovered electricity. We romanticize the achievements of morons.
        taejo 5y ago
        > Creditors CAN accept them because states do not disallow it. The document says the states cannot force creditors to accept payment by card, and they don't. I'm not trying to romanticize the constitution, and I agree that parts of it are pretty moronic. I don't really have an opinion about this section either way, but my point is that it is in force as it stands, literally.
  - unstatusthequo 5y ago
    Miami isn’t a State. ;)
kevinventullo 5y ago
It’s different because you can’t actually use MIAMICOIN to conduct transactions. If they suddenly decided that, I dunno, sales tax could be paid in MIAMICOIN, I have a feeling the federal government would quickly become interested.

This is no different from Miami printing dollars no? How is this legal?

by sprafa 5y ago

This is no different from Miami printing dollars no? How is this legal?

zepto 5y ago

This is no different from Miami selling numbered prints of an artwork. How is it not legal?

sprafa 5y ago
An artwork? Well, maybe.
elliekelly 5y ago
Which begs an interesting question: could a city selling of numbered prints of artwork ever be an "investment contract" under Howey[1]? I think perhaps yes. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEC_v._W._J._Howey_Co https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEC_v._W._J._Howey_Co.

JumpCrisscross 5y ago

> This is no different from Miami printing dollars no? How is this legal? Is there a prohibition on states printing money?

Veliladon 5y ago
Literally Article I, Section 10 of the Constitution. No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.
- ddalex 5y ago
  > make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts Since the dollar is not pegged to a gold or silver standard, I'd say the ship of this section has already sailed.
  - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
    These are limits on the states, not the federal government [1]. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_Tender_Cases https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_Tender_Cases
- kktkti9 5y ago
  I suppose since we use paper bills, and debit cards, most states are violating the “make any Thing but gold and silver…” bit. Pretty sure the only bits in that doc taken seriously are the lack of rules against meddling in elections, and leveraging 1A and 2A to rile the masses.
  - taejo 5y ago
    Paper bills are issued by the Federal Reserve Banks, not the states. Debit cards aren't "Tender in Payment of Debts" at all: creditors don't have to accept payment by debit card.
    - kktkti9 5y ago
      Creditors CAN accept them because states do not disallow it. The point is taking the language in that document literally is a ridiculous exercise. The men that wrote it had barely discovered electricity. We romanticize the achievements of morons.
      - taejo 5y ago
        > Creditors CAN accept them because states do not disallow it. The document says the states cannot force creditors to accept payment by card, and they don't. I'm not trying to romanticize the constitution, and I agree that parts of it are pretty moronic. I don't really have an opinion about this section either way, but my point is that it is in force as it stands, literally.
- unstatusthequo 5y ago
  Miami isn’t a State. ;)

kevinventullo 5y ago

It’s different because you can’t actually use MIAMICOIN to conduct transactions. If they suddenly decided that, I dunno, sales tax could be paid in MIAMICOIN, I have a feeling the federal government would quickly become interested.