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Most voters - and donors - aren't highly skilled engineers. But politicians are judged on their overall stewardship of the economy. Anyway, the US voter is weir

Most voters - and donors - aren't highly skilled engineers. But politicians are judged on their overall stewardship of the economy. Anyway, the US voter is weird; they think all sorts of professions are overpaid. Why should a bunch of nerds sitting at a desk make six figures? With that said, that might be changing - it might be shifting more towards overall worker outcomes over just the stock market.

MattGaiser 5y ago
Indeed. People think it is crazy that government software engineers make 80K for "typing."
jl2718 5y ago
Oh yeah because they did such a great job at raising median citizen wages too. What is this ‘economy’ that they are such great stewards of? Who owns it?
iso1631 5y ago
> Anyway, the US voter is weird; they think all sorts of professions are overpaid. Why should a bunch of nerds sitting at a desk make six figures? But oddly enough not PE teachers, who tend to be the highest paid public employees in the state -- https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/09/21/these-are-the-highest-paid-public-employees-in-every-state-2/2/ https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/09/21/these-are-th...
- meetups323 5y ago
  Don't be disingenuous. PE teachers and football coaches are not the same at all and you know it. Football coaches bring in literal millions in revenue, your Alabama example costs 8MM/year in salary but returns around 150MM in sponsorship/ad revenue/donations/etc. https://www.businessinsider.com/schools-most-revenue-college-sports-2016-10#5-alabama--1489-million-21 https://www.businessinsider.com/schools-most-revenue-college...
  - JohnWhigham 5y ago
    And those are the best of the best. Go look at a middling D2/D3 school's football coach salary. Guarantee it won't be as impressive. And then remember that they also have a staff of position coaches and whatnot under them.
    - iso1631 5y ago
      > And then remember that they also have a staff of position coaches and whatnot under them. And people wonder why there's a STEM crisis. When your society had decided it's more important to employ multiple full time extra curricular activity coaches for a high school while cutting STEM investment (and thus outsourcing the function) you're on the fast track to the bottom of the pile.
- ktkoffroth 5y ago
  Are you really going to label Head Coaches of major sports programs as PE teachers? The reason they are paid highly is because they carry the majority of responsibility in the success of sports teams, which generate revenue (in the hundreds of millions in the case of Football and Basketball) for the athletic departments of these universities. That revenue is used to fund literally every other collegiate sport, and provide scholarships to tens of thousands of students nationally. These positions are unique because they are simultaneously extremely competitive (most coaches are fired within 5 years) and tied (loosely) to a public entity. To call them PE teachers is a ridiculous presumption, no matter how overpaid you believe they are (and rightly so).
  - jl2718 5y ago
    Why does the state own a sports team?
    - iso1631 5y ago
      dysfunctional priorities of a hedonistic society in the end days. I suspect Lanistas were well compensated in their society in the end days too.
      - mahogany 5y ago
        But were they well-compensated in the beginning and middle days, too? It seems unlikely that sports and games are only popular during the end days. (Unless you're just saying that their compensation should decrease.)
- thomaslangston 5y ago
  Please do not lump PE teachers with football coaches
JohnWhigham 5y ago
There's large swaths of Republicans that think public teachers are overpaid...it's mind-boggling.
- DaveExeter 5y ago
  In certain areas, public school teachers are incredibly overpaid! $1k+/day compensation for the elementary school 'art teacher' is far above reasonable. But politicians get power by robbing Peter to make Paul rich!
  - handrous 5y ago
    Where the hell are art teachers making $20,000/month?
    - blululu 5y ago
      120k per year is not unreasonable for teachers if you start counting benefits as wages. The pension plans of most public school teachers are generous, special tax breaks are effectively a form of salary. In California the school teachers are exempt from social security. These don’t show up in the nominal salary, but it is still money paid to them (some of it indirectly).
      - JohnWhigham 5y ago
        I would love to see exactly how many public school teachers are actually getting 120k. I'm very certain they are at the very high end and very few in number. Most are getting slightly above the national median income.
        mrtranscendence 5y ago
        Depends on your area. Teachers where I'm from (greater Cincinnati) don't get anywhere near 120k even with many years of experience. My brother in northern Kentucky gets $55k after 15 years. In New York state average pay shoots up to highest-in-the-nation $85k (source: https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/teacher-pay-by-state https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/teacher-pay...). Maybe someone with a lot of experience in certain specific areas could make $120k, but it's not going to be common.
LorenPechtel 5y ago
Yup. 15-20 years ago, factory floor, troubleshooting a problem that only showed up in production. I overheard a couple of guys saying that I was overpaid for being able to type fast, especially as I spent most of my time just standing there.

MattGaiser 5y ago

Indeed. People think it is crazy that government software engineers make 80K for "typing."

jl2718 5y ago

Oh yeah because they did such a great job at raising median citizen wages too. What is this ‘economy’ that they are such great stewards of? Who owns it?

iso1631 5y ago

> Anyway, the US voter is weird; they think all sorts of professions are overpaid. Why should a bunch of nerds sitting at a desk make six figures? But oddly enough not PE teachers, who tend to be the highest paid public employees in the state -- https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/09/21/these-are-the-highest-paid-public-employees-in-every-state-2/2/ https://247wallst.com/special-report/2020/09/21/these-are-th...

meetups323 5y ago
Don't be disingenuous. PE teachers and football coaches are not the same at all and you know it. Football coaches bring in literal millions in revenue, your Alabama example costs 8MM/year in salary but returns around 150MM in sponsorship/ad revenue/donations/etc. https://www.businessinsider.com/schools-most-revenue-college-sports-2016-10#5-alabama--1489-million-21 https://www.businessinsider.com/schools-most-revenue-college...
- JohnWhigham 5y ago
  And those are the best of the best. Go look at a middling D2/D3 school's football coach salary. Guarantee it won't be as impressive. And then remember that they also have a staff of position coaches and whatnot under them.
  - iso1631 5y ago
    > And then remember that they also have a staff of position coaches and whatnot under them. And people wonder why there's a STEM crisis. When your society had decided it's more important to employ multiple full time extra curricular activity coaches for a high school while cutting STEM investment (and thus outsourcing the function) you're on the fast track to the bottom of the pile.
ktkoffroth 5y ago
Are you really going to label Head Coaches of major sports programs as PE teachers? The reason they are paid highly is because they carry the majority of responsibility in the success of sports teams, which generate revenue (in the hundreds of millions in the case of Football and Basketball) for the athletic departments of these universities. That revenue is used to fund literally every other collegiate sport, and provide scholarships to tens of thousands of students nationally. These positions are unique because they are simultaneously extremely competitive (most coaches are fired within 5 years) and tied (loosely) to a public entity. To call them PE teachers is a ridiculous presumption, no matter how overpaid you believe they are (and rightly so).
- jl2718 5y ago
  Why does the state own a sports team?
  - iso1631 5y ago
    dysfunctional priorities of a hedonistic society in the end days. I suspect Lanistas were well compensated in their society in the end days too.
    - mahogany 5y ago
      But were they well-compensated in the beginning and middle days, too? It seems unlikely that sports and games are only popular during the end days. (Unless you're just saying that their compensation should decrease.)
thomaslangston 5y ago
Please do not lump PE teachers with football coaches

JohnWhigham 5y ago

There's large swaths of Republicans that think public teachers are overpaid...it's mind-boggling.

DaveExeter 5y ago
In certain areas, public school teachers are incredibly overpaid! $1k+/day compensation for the elementary school 'art teacher' is far above reasonable. But politicians get power by robbing Peter to make Paul rich!
- handrous 5y ago
  Where the hell are art teachers making $20,000/month?
  - blululu 5y ago
    120k per year is not unreasonable for teachers if you start counting benefits as wages. The pension plans of most public school teachers are generous, special tax breaks are effectively a form of salary. In California the school teachers are exempt from social security. These don’t show up in the nominal salary, but it is still money paid to them (some of it indirectly).
    - JohnWhigham 5y ago
      I would love to see exactly how many public school teachers are actually getting 120k. I'm very certain they are at the very high end and very few in number. Most are getting slightly above the national median income.
      - mrtranscendence 5y ago
        Depends on your area. Teachers where I'm from (greater Cincinnati) don't get anywhere near 120k even with many years of experience. My brother in northern Kentucky gets $55k after 15 years. In New York state average pay shoots up to highest-in-the-nation $85k (source: https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/teacher-pay-by-state https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/teacher-pay...). Maybe someone with a lot of experience in certain specific areas could make $120k, but it's not going to be common.

LorenPechtel 5y ago

Yup. 15-20 years ago, factory floor, troubleshooting a problem that only showed up in production. I overheard a couple of guys saying that I was overpaid for being able to type fast, especially as I spent most of my time just standing there.