4 ms·

I'm taking bets on how much time elapses between now and when Mattel comes out with a transgender line.

HorizonXP 5y ago
Eh, I'll take that bet. They're still a company, and by the numbers, I would think it represents a very small minority. The sales probably wouldn't make it worth it. It might be worth it as a marketing tactic though, who knows.
- puppet-master 5y ago
  Trans advocacy is a policy game at every level, not a numbers game. At the national level for example, the UN universal periodic review began recently including trans rights in its methodology. It is far more likely Mattel would respond to this kind of pressure from some kind of industry group than any expectation of high sales (although given a decade of this kind of influence organic sales will be a natural consequence, which is why advocacy efforts are so important to watch to understand the future of society)
dragonwriter 5y ago
> I'm taking bets on how much time elapses between now and when Mattel comes out with a transgender line. Er, how would that differ? Its not like Barbie’s sex-assigned-at-birth is included on a certificate with the doll in the first place, or like the doll is so anatomically correct that one could determine what that likely was from the kind of genitalia and whether or not they had the telltale signs of surgical modification.
- puppet-master 5y ago
  Sex is observed, not assigned, this is true even in the case of intersex individuals. The modern construct of gender is largely a function of environmental and media exposure. Unlike sex, no falsifiable tests exist for it. Don't confuse the two.
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > Sex is observed, not assigned Various indicia are observed, sex (more accurately, “socially ascribed gender”, but the established terminology is “sex”) is assigned based on some subset of sex-related indicia. > The modern construct of gender The modern understanding of the distinction between sex, ascribed gender, and gender identity may be new, but the things themselves aren’t modern constructs. Biological sex (or at least the individual traits that make it up), socially ascribed gender, and gender identity have always existed.
    - puppet-master 5y ago
      > Various indicia are observed, sex (more accurately, “socially ascribed gender”, but the established terminology is “sex”) is assigned based on some subset of sex-related indicia. This is an intentional and politically motivated conflation, that I notice you have attempted in several different threads, and it's why I replied here at all. Sex is a hard attribute that can be measured empirically at the chromosomal level, stop attempting to redefine it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex

Eh, I'll take that bet. They're still a company, and by the numbers, I would think it represents a very small minority. The sales probably wouldn't make it worth it. It might be worth it as a marketing tactic though, who knows.

puppet-master 5y ago
Trans advocacy is a policy game at every level, not a numbers game. At the national level for example, the UN universal periodic review began recently including trans rights in its methodology. It is far more likely Mattel would respond to this kind of pressure from some kind of industry group than any expectation of high sales (although given a decade of this kind of influence organic sales will be a natural consequence, which is why advocacy efforts are so important to watch to understand the future of society)

dragonwriter 5y ago

> I'm taking bets on how much time elapses between now and when Mattel comes out with a transgender line. Er, how would that differ? Its not like Barbie’s sex-assigned-at-birth is included on a certificate with the doll in the first place, or like the doll is so anatomically correct that one could determine what that likely was from the kind of genitalia and whether or not they had the telltale signs of surgical modification.

puppet-master 5y ago
Sex is observed, not assigned, this is true even in the case of intersex individuals. The modern construct of gender is largely a function of environmental and media exposure. Unlike sex, no falsifiable tests exist for it. Don't confuse the two.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > Sex is observed, not assigned Various indicia are observed, sex (more accurately, “socially ascribed gender”, but the established terminology is “sex”) is assigned based on some subset of sex-related indicia. > The modern construct of gender The modern understanding of the distinction between sex, ascribed gender, and gender identity may be new, but the things themselves aren’t modern constructs. Biological sex (or at least the individual traits that make it up), socially ascribed gender, and gender identity have always existed.
  - puppet-master 5y ago
    > Various indicia are observed, sex (more accurately, “socially ascribed gender”, but the established terminology is “sex”) is assigned based on some subset of sex-related indicia. This is an intentional and politically motivated conflation, that I notice you have attempted in several different threads, and it's why I replied here at all. Sex is a hard attribute that can be measured empirically at the chromosomal level, stop attempting to redefine it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex