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At least in my organization, these Ops people did not get the whole point about DevOps. They are basically just administering servers and using Ansible to do it

At least in my organization, these Ops people did not get the whole point about DevOps. They are basically just administering servers and using Ansible to do it. E.g. if a services does not start after running a playbook, they are logging in and restarting it, instead of fixing the playbook. Ansible runs on a weekly schedule instead of provisioning based on application needs. They have their own playbooks for standard systems and doing custom modifications through SSH, if you have special needs. I could go on. They just totally missed the point of DevOps, it's just Ops with DevOps tools. You can compare it with how we/they are doing agile.

skywhopper 5y ago
I would say your approach of blaming “them” for missing the point, misses the point. Think about your own responsibility. DevOps is not a single role in an org, but a way of doing business and collaborating between dev and ops teams. If your ops support is not sufficient for the devs’ needs, then the devs should be working with ops to fix it. If the devs are saying “oh, ops is no good at DevOps, so that’s why our deployment process sucks” then it’s as much the devs’ fault as the ops team.
- allendoerfer 5y ago
  And I am trying to do so every day. This is not some small operation, where I can just go over to a different desk and talk about just doing it differently. I am talking about an organization with hundreds of thousands of employees. In this case Ops is literally a different legal entity. I have no say whatsoever over "them". If you want to change something, it's more about constantly begging and nagging. It is a very fine line, you risk to become difficult to work with. After all, sometimes you actually need "them" to do something for you. It also costs a lot of energy. At some point most people just stop trying and focus on more important things in life.

skywhopper 5y ago

I would say your approach of blaming “them” for missing the point, misses the point. Think about your own responsibility. DevOps is not a single role in an org, but a way of doing business and collaborating between dev and ops teams. If your ops support is not sufficient for the devs’ needs, then the devs should be working with ops to fix it. If the devs are saying “oh, ops is no good at DevOps, so that’s why our deployment process sucks” then it’s as much the devs’ fault as the ops team.

allendoerfer 5y ago
And I am trying to do so every day. This is not some small operation, where I can just go over to a different desk and talk about just doing it differently. I am talking about an organization with hundreds of thousands of employees. In this case Ops is literally a different legal entity. I have no say whatsoever over "them". If you want to change something, it's more about constantly begging and nagging. It is a very fine line, you risk to become difficult to work with. After all, sometimes you actually need "them" to do something for you. It also costs a lot of energy. At some point most people just stop trying and focus on more important things in life.