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Why would Apple be involved here? Wouldn't this just be a regular application, just like any other? Or is this yet another case of Apple's APIs being too limit

Why would Apple be involved here? Wouldn't this just be a regular application, just like any other? Or is this yet another case of Apple's APIs being too limited, so they made themselves yet another loophole rather than fix it?

obenn 5y ago
This is an integration with Apple Wallet and Apple Pay, so it does indeed go beyond a regular app.
jackson1442 5y ago
These are added to your phone through a regular application, but ID cards are added to Wallet.app just like concert tickets, plane tickets, payment cards, transit cards, etc. Apple has to be involved as they are the relationship manager for all of the physical security companies (TransactCampus, Allegion, etc.) to get them to read and understand the ID on the phone. It's also PR.
michaelt 5y ago
A few years ago, before Apple got involved themselves, I worked somewhere that brought a top-of-the-line smartphone based access control system. The problem was it didn't reliably open doors, which is really the only thing you want from an access control system. Apparently at the time NFC was for Apple Pay only, so the vendor had to use bluetooth; and apparently there was no way for them to keep their app running and the bluetooth radio running all the time. The Android version was no better. Within a year they had switched back to plastic ID cards.
Nextgrid 5y ago
Apple does not allow apps raw access to the NFC controller, so yes it's an annoying business decision from Apple rather than a technical limitation.
- Jcowell 5y ago
  This is half true there are NFC API’s to use the NFC chip. What they cannot do use their own implementation. This results in a way better experience in the user since there’s no pointless fragmentation.
  - Nextgrid 5y ago
    > This is half true there are NFC API’s to use the NFC chip There is no API to send raw APDUs to a card or simulate a card (receiving APDUs from the reader). This makes it a non-starter for implementing any kind of smart card (such as receiving a challenge from a reader, signing it with a private key stored in the app - potentially delegated to the secure element - and returning it). The APIs they provide only allow reading static values off "NFC Forum" tags which is useless for any kind of security or access control.
    - realityking 5y ago
      They've expanded the API quite a bit in iOS 14 and you can now also write certain NFC tags: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/corenfc/creating_nfc_tags_from_your_iphone https://developer.apple.com/documentation/corenfc/creating_n... Still can't create payment apps though. No idea if this would be sufficient for an access control system.

obenn 5y ago

This is an integration with Apple Wallet and Apple Pay, so it does indeed go beyond a regular app.

jackson1442 5y ago

These are added to your phone through a regular application, but ID cards are added to Wallet.app just like concert tickets, plane tickets, payment cards, transit cards, etc. Apple has to be involved as they are the relationship manager for all of the physical security companies (TransactCampus, Allegion, etc.) to get them to read and understand the ID on the phone. It's also PR.

michaelt 5y ago

A few years ago, before Apple got involved themselves, I worked somewhere that brought a top-of-the-line smartphone based access control system. The problem was it didn't reliably open doors, which is really the only thing you want from an access control system. Apparently at the time NFC was for Apple Pay only, so the vendor had to use bluetooth; and apparently there was no way for them to keep their app running and the bluetooth radio running all the time. The Android version was no better. Within a year they had switched back to plastic ID cards.

Nextgrid 5y ago

Apple does not allow apps raw access to the NFC controller, so yes it's an annoying business decision from Apple rather than a technical limitation.

Jcowell 5y ago
This is half true there are NFC API’s to use the NFC chip. What they cannot do use their own implementation. This results in a way better experience in the user since there’s no pointless fragmentation.
- Nextgrid 5y ago
  > This is half true there are NFC API’s to use the NFC chip There is no API to send raw APDUs to a card or simulate a card (receiving APDUs from the reader). This makes it a non-starter for implementing any kind of smart card (such as receiving a challenge from a reader, signing it with a private key stored in the app - potentially delegated to the secure element - and returning it). The APIs they provide only allow reading static values off "NFC Forum" tags which is useless for any kind of security or access control.
  - realityking 5y ago
    They've expanded the API quite a bit in iOS 14 and you can now also write certain NFC tags: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/corenfc/creating_nfc_tags_from_your_iphone https://developer.apple.com/documentation/corenfc/creating_n... Still can't create payment apps though. No idea if this would be sufficient for an access control system.