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Meanwhile if you go to big US retail stores or shop online, a large majority of the merchandise is Chinese so US retail companies are helping China while China

Meanwhile if you go to big US retail stores or shop online, a large majority of the merchandise is Chinese so US retail companies are helping China while China is actively hurting the US. If you don't believe it, try to shop for products that aren't made in China. Here's the data to back it up: https://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/statistics/highlights/toppartners.html https://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/statistics/highlights/t...

tomytosian 5y ago
now its ok to say it right? because the guy who fought against it was deemed a racist for saying it.
- HelloMcFly 5y ago
  He was deemed a racist for all of his racist behavior. The most positive thing people had to say about his presidency was his efforts to confront China on trade, though the first phase of that trade deal appears to be a failure. I don't know how much blame to assign him personally though, we're not seeing many examples of success to compare it to.
- AvesMerit 5y ago
  To be clear, that guy was deemed racist for promoting stereotypes from a position of power. There are ways of fighting against CCP / Chinese govt. aggression without resorting to racism
  - tomytosian 5y ago
    sure. he was deemed a racist for saying china is responsible for the virus and was countered by politicians who willingly infected people with covid by pushing them to go to superspread events from chinatown parades to BLM riots.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - HelloMcFly 5y ago
      Comments like these make it really difficult to not argue on the internet. * He was deemed a racist for many reasons. One of which was using his leadership and influence to stoke anti-Asian sentiment. You're not debating this point, right? Whataboutism is one thing, but worse when paired with denialism. * "Politicians who willingly infected people with covid" - Does it bother you that politicians would downplay the safety of American citizens related to an infectious disease to suit their own political ends? Or is this is a criticism you only levy against your political rivals? Do you really want to compare scorecards on Trump vs. his political rivals on public health? * Ignoring that the vast majority of BLM events were peaceful, which superspreader events are you referring to? They were outside, in the summer, often mobile, with a large share of mask-wearing attendees. I don't see any evidence of any of these events becoming superspreader events.
      - tomytosian 5y ago
        you are the one doing whataboutism right now. I am just arguing that trump was never racist against asian and that he tried to do things and was deemed a racist as a result. I never said he did not downplay covid. everyone did including Sir Fauci and all the democrats.
  - zepto 5y ago
    He did do that, but to be clear he was also called a racist for things like imposing travel restrictions with China early in the coronavirus pandemic. It’s hard to take seriously the claim that accusations of racism are always made carefully and never used as a cheap partisan attack.
- nemothekid 5y ago
  >because the guy who fought against it was deemed a racist for saying it The guy who was against it was a racist because he couldn't articulate anything other than "China bad" and his policies to address China were useless at best and harmful to America at worst. He only wanted to look tough against a made up enemy but refused to change anything at home. If he was actually serious about competing with China, we would have been talking about Trump's infrastructure bill and had a plan on how to ween us off Chinese high-tech manufacturing (which is the best in the world), but now 4 years later we are scrambling trying to figure out how we will build fabs (one part of the equation) at home. For all the crying about China, he did shockingly little in actually addressing the issue (like almost all the issues he cried about). Anyone who looks at out current situation and comes to the conclusion we need to bomb China is a racist in my eyes. They are only motivated a fear of a rising eastern power and have no motivation in actually investing stateside to improve American hegemony.
  - tomytosian 5y ago
    I dont know why u talking about bombing china. China is obviously lying about the virus, is restricting access to information and is at the inception of the greatest disaster in recent history. meanwhile their gdp is almost back to two digit growth while some people are in the street, died and countries collapsed. they need to be held accountable. trump is right. to answer the rest of your comment:tsmc is building its factory in the US, mainly because of trump actions, trump also destroyed huawei, a company that never respected any patents and IPs and just cheated its way into market domination backed up by CCP money. in a few weeks he totally made this company unable to produce and sell its devices, he turned the trade balance claiming that china was having a better hand than usa (which was and still is true). I am asian. I have never heard one racist thing against asians from trump. However. Democrats and Journalists permanently think and say that Asians are one entity, corroborating the hive mind notion that they are all the same and have no complex thought. This is totally racist. Many countries in Asia such as Japan and Korea are also calling covid the China Virus. the world is more complex than the petty moves of trump haters and while the way he speaks can be too frank and rude he was never perceived as a racist in asia. I guess the problem is mostly with politically minded americans and europeans. and finally if criminals - released by democrats because of covid- and crazy people are beating asians in the street. I would rather look at the profile of the perpetrators and draw out conclusions. Most of the people were biden voters and Id argue than 90% of the people I saw commiting crime in NY on asians were voting AOC or BIDEN for sure. does it mean biden is racist?
- trasz 5y ago
  I find it somewhat surprising that people are still defending that loser.
DiogenesKynikos 5y ago
If you go to China, you'll see that American and European brands are everywhere. These companies are making massive profits in China. The trade is by no means in one direction.
- systemvoltage 5y ago
  They're still made in China. Volkswagen to Nike clothes.
  - DiogenesKynikos 5y ago
    That depends very much on the product. For iPhones, which are ubiquitous in China, what percentage of the value added comes from China? The final assembly is in China, but most of the value is imported. The same goes for many products.
    - DiogenesKynikos 5y ago
      Since you mentioned VW, I just looked up the figures for German exports, and the largest destination for German car parts is China. China imports about $9 billion in German car parts each year. That's in addition to about $17 billion worth of cars exported from Germany to China each year, making China the 3rd largest export market for German cars.
colinmhayes 5y ago
Buying Chinese goods isn't actively hurting the US... it's helping by providing Americans with cheaper goods.
- Sabinus 5y ago
  But you're trading that for manufacturing jobs.
  - jayd16 5y ago
    Cheaper parts means you can spend on local labor. Its much more complex than "you should be forced to buy American no matter the cost."
- mc32 5y ago
  As they lose jobs and have even less purchasing power… or trade in their machinist job for work at the dollar store… yah. I bet they like that they can buy a $5 T-shirt instead of paying $30, swap their red-wings for off-brand shoes to trudge the dollar store as a security guard. But, it is a lovely bargain for the professional class. Give me cheap and take my middle class job!
  - throwaway34241 5y ago
    > Give me cheap and take my middle class job! The trade-offs with trade are a little more complex than that. For example, if foreign steel was super cheap, you could have the people previously working in steel work in construction, and build more buildings. Or if midwestern auto manufacturing jobs were middle-class due to unions, but the economy shifts to services like Amazon, there is no inherent reason why service jobs couldn’t also be unionized. In principle it’s not that different from automation - you can think of either as a black box you put money in and get product out. If you are playing your other cards right (admittedly a big if) it would be possible to largely benefit from either.
    - mc32 5y ago
      Sure! Except instead of replacing the machinists jobs with higher value jobs, they replaced them with security guard jobs at the Walmart and Dollar Tree. That’s happened every round. The working class has never got the long shrift in this deal. They always get screwed but they’re supposed to believe ‘this time’ it will be different.
seriousquestion 5y ago
Furthermore, how many US industries and companies are compromised? Hollywood, the NBA, Blizzard, are a few that come to mind. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/10/10/stephen-colberts-pander-express-is-a-brilliant-takedown-of-how-hollywood-sucks-up-to-china/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/10/10/steph... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blitzchung_controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blitzchung_controversy
silicon2401 5y ago
Yet any suggestion of avoiding Chinese products or supporting Chinese business is often attacked as racism or nationalism.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

tomytosian 5y ago

now its ok to say it right? because the guy who fought against it was deemed a racist for saying it.

HelloMcFly 5y ago
He was deemed a racist for all of his racist behavior. The most positive thing people had to say about his presidency was his efforts to confront China on trade, though the first phase of that trade deal appears to be a failure. I don't know how much blame to assign him personally though, we're not seeing many examples of success to compare it to.
AvesMerit 5y ago
To be clear, that guy was deemed racist for promoting stereotypes from a position of power. There are ways of fighting against CCP / Chinese govt. aggression without resorting to racism
- tomytosian 5y ago
  sure. he was deemed a racist for saying china is responsible for the virus and was countered by politicians who willingly infected people with covid by pushing them to go to superspread events from chinatown parades to BLM riots.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - HelloMcFly 5y ago
    Comments like these make it really difficult to not argue on the internet. * He was deemed a racist for many reasons. One of which was using his leadership and influence to stoke anti-Asian sentiment. You're not debating this point, right? Whataboutism is one thing, but worse when paired with denialism. * "Politicians who willingly infected people with covid" - Does it bother you that politicians would downplay the safety of American citizens related to an infectious disease to suit their own political ends? Or is this is a criticism you only levy against your political rivals? Do you really want to compare scorecards on Trump vs. his political rivals on public health? * Ignoring that the vast majority of BLM events were peaceful, which superspreader events are you referring to? They were outside, in the summer, often mobile, with a large share of mask-wearing attendees. I don't see any evidence of any of these events becoming superspreader events.
    - tomytosian 5y ago
      you are the one doing whataboutism right now. I am just arguing that trump was never racist against asian and that he tried to do things and was deemed a racist as a result. I never said he did not downplay covid. everyone did including Sir Fauci and all the democrats.
- zepto 5y ago
  He did do that, but to be clear he was also called a racist for things like imposing travel restrictions with China early in the coronavirus pandemic. It’s hard to take seriously the claim that accusations of racism are always made carefully and never used as a cheap partisan attack.
nemothekid 5y ago
>because the guy who fought against it was deemed a racist for saying it The guy who was against it was a racist because he couldn't articulate anything other than "China bad" and his policies to address China were useless at best and harmful to America at worst. He only wanted to look tough against a made up enemy but refused to change anything at home. If he was actually serious about competing with China, we would have been talking about Trump's infrastructure bill and had a plan on how to ween us off Chinese high-tech manufacturing (which is the best in the world), but now 4 years later we are scrambling trying to figure out how we will build fabs (one part of the equation) at home. For all the crying about China, he did shockingly little in actually addressing the issue (like almost all the issues he cried about). Anyone who looks at out current situation and comes to the conclusion we need to bomb China is a racist in my eyes. They are only motivated a fear of a rising eastern power and have no motivation in actually investing stateside to improve American hegemony.
- tomytosian 5y ago
  I dont know why u talking about bombing china. China is obviously lying about the virus, is restricting access to information and is at the inception of the greatest disaster in recent history. meanwhile their gdp is almost back to two digit growth while some people are in the street, died and countries collapsed. they need to be held accountable. trump is right. to answer the rest of your comment:tsmc is building its factory in the US, mainly because of trump actions, trump also destroyed huawei, a company that never respected any patents and IPs and just cheated its way into market domination backed up by CCP money. in a few weeks he totally made this company unable to produce and sell its devices, he turned the trade balance claiming that china was having a better hand than usa (which was and still is true). I am asian. I have never heard one racist thing against asians from trump. However. Democrats and Journalists permanently think and say that Asians are one entity, corroborating the hive mind notion that they are all the same and have no complex thought. This is totally racist. Many countries in Asia such as Japan and Korea are also calling covid the China Virus. the world is more complex than the petty moves of trump haters and while the way he speaks can be too frank and rude he was never perceived as a racist in asia. I guess the problem is mostly with politically minded americans and europeans. and finally if criminals - released by democrats because of covid- and crazy people are beating asians in the street. I would rather look at the profile of the perpetrators and draw out conclusions. Most of the people were biden voters and Id argue than 90% of the people I saw commiting crime in NY on asians were voting AOC or BIDEN for sure. does it mean biden is racist?
trasz 5y ago
I find it somewhat surprising that people are still defending that loser.

DiogenesKynikos 5y ago

If you go to China, you'll see that American and European brands are everywhere. These companies are making massive profits in China. The trade is by no means in one direction.

systemvoltage 5y ago
They're still made in China. Volkswagen to Nike clothes.
- DiogenesKynikos 5y ago
  That depends very much on the product. For iPhones, which are ubiquitous in China, what percentage of the value added comes from China? The final assembly is in China, but most of the value is imported. The same goes for many products.
  - DiogenesKynikos 5y ago
    Since you mentioned VW, I just looked up the figures for German exports, and the largest destination for German car parts is China. China imports about $9 billion in German car parts each year. That's in addition to about $17 billion worth of cars exported from Germany to China each year, making China the 3rd largest export market for German cars.

colinmhayes 5y ago

Buying Chinese goods isn't actively hurting the US... it's helping by providing Americans with cheaper goods.

Sabinus 5y ago
But you're trading that for manufacturing jobs.
- jayd16 5y ago
  Cheaper parts means you can spend on local labor. Its much more complex than "you should be forced to buy American no matter the cost."
mc32 5y ago
As they lose jobs and have even less purchasing power… or trade in their machinist job for work at the dollar store… yah. I bet they like that they can buy a $5 T-shirt instead of paying $30, swap their red-wings for off-brand shoes to trudge the dollar store as a security guard. But, it is a lovely bargain for the professional class. Give me cheap and take my middle class job!
- throwaway34241 5y ago
  > Give me cheap and take my middle class job! The trade-offs with trade are a little more complex than that. For example, if foreign steel was super cheap, you could have the people previously working in steel work in construction, and build more buildings. Or if midwestern auto manufacturing jobs were middle-class due to unions, but the economy shifts to services like Amazon, there is no inherent reason why service jobs couldn’t also be unionized. In principle it’s not that different from automation - you can think of either as a black box you put money in and get product out. If you are playing your other cards right (admittedly a big if) it would be possible to largely benefit from either.
  - mc32 5y ago
    Sure! Except instead of replacing the machinists jobs with higher value jobs, they replaced them with security guard jobs at the Walmart and Dollar Tree. That’s happened every round. The working class has never got the long shrift in this deal. They always get screwed but they’re supposed to believe ‘this time’ it will be different.

seriousquestion 5y ago

Furthermore, how many US industries and companies are compromised? Hollywood, the NBA, Blizzard, are a few that come to mind. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/10/10/stephen-colberts-pander-express-is-a-brilliant-takedown-of-how-hollywood-sucks-up-to-china/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/10/10/steph... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blitzchung_controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blitzchung_controversy

silicon2401 5y ago

Yet any suggestion of avoiding Chinese products or supporting Chinese business is often attacked as racism or nationalism.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]