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Again, I recommend you read the article, as it specifically mentions polls done involving broad cross-sections of economists, and non-American economists. Inst

Again, I recommend you read the article, as it specifically mentions polls done involving broad cross-sections of economists, and non-American economists. Instead of assuming the article has no valuable insights, I recommend you read it. >>Rent control can take many forms: rental caps, incentives/benefits, zoning and housing policies, etc. Rent control only takes the form of caps on rent, or caps on rent increases. The other policies you mention are not defined as rent control.

ricardobeat 5y ago
Do you think I decided the article is US-centered just by looking at the URL?
- CryptoPunk 5y ago
  So you read it, and didn't notice the article provided statistics on the views of economists at large - as opposed to those of a handpicked few - on rent control, or the many mentions of non-American political leaders' and economists' views on rent control? Can you at least admit that the economics field at large opposes rent control?
  - cloudfifty 5y ago
    > Can you at least admit that the economics field at large opposes rent control? It's pretty pointless to talk about rent control if one hasn't established what the desired outcome is. An "efficient" market? Affordable housing for the common man? Rent control keeps on providing affordable housing in Europe. Abolishing it would cause the rents to rise (both economists and the people promoting it admits to that) and thus give billions to land lords and property owners. But I guess that's a feature, not a bug?
    - CryptoPunk 5y ago
      Rent control makes housing less affordable for the common man. This is the near-unanimous conclusion of economists, who have studied this issue for upwards of a century. Rent control makes housing less affordable than it would otherwise be in Europe too.
      - cloudfifty 5y ago
        This is simply false. Maybe economists models of an optimal market somehow shows that. But on the ground facts refute it without a shadow of a doubt. One cause of this is usually that government involvement in the production of housing is assumed to be out of the question by those economists. People are not stupid. Why do you think there's so much resistance in Europe towards market based rents if they think it will actually lower their rents? Should people be thrown out of their apartment they've lived in their whole life just because the property owner can find someone wealthier that's willing to pay more? How is that a desired outcome for the common man? People would rather want that the housing is created by the state than have that crazily class based stratification of our cities.
        CryptoPunk 5y ago
        You're saying that a belief that has near total consensus among the experts is "simply false". You clearly haven't examined the evidence on rent control, and are simply making assumptions to avoid having to contend with the possibility that your preconceived notion is wrong. >>Why do you think there's so much resistance in Europe towards market based rents if they think it will actually lower their rents? 1. Because economics is a difficult subject to understand, made all the more difficult by the multitude of special interests who need to discredit economics in order to rationalize the anti-free-market impositions that provide them with rent-seeking opportunities like subsidies and artificially suppressed rent. 2. Because people who already have rent-controlled units in high-demand cities don't want to give up their privilege for the benefit of the people of the nation at large, who, by virtue of rent control starving the housing sector of the capital to build more units in those cities, miss out on the opportunity to find a unit in the high-demand cities. >>Should people be thrown out of their apartment they've lived in their whole life just because the property owner can find someone wealthier that's willing to pay more? YES! They're renters. If they want the stability of not having to ever worry about housing costs increasing, they need to buy their own units. They can't rent, and then expect the stability of being an owner. We need to be giving housing in the highest-in-demand localities to the people who can make the best use of it economically, which would be those who are willing and able to pay the most for it. We also need to be giving investors the incentive to invest in new housing in these highest-in-demand localities so that more people can live in them, and that requires allowing rental rates to reflect the supply/demand dynamics. This is basic economics.

ricardobeat 5y ago

Do you think I decided the article is US-centered just by looking at the URL?

CryptoPunk 5y ago
So you read it, and didn't notice the article provided statistics on the views of economists at large - as opposed to those of a handpicked few - on rent control, or the many mentions of non-American political leaders' and economists' views on rent control? Can you at least admit that the economics field at large opposes rent control?
- cloudfifty 5y ago
  > Can you at least admit that the economics field at large opposes rent control? It's pretty pointless to talk about rent control if one hasn't established what the desired outcome is. An "efficient" market? Affordable housing for the common man? Rent control keeps on providing affordable housing in Europe. Abolishing it would cause the rents to rise (both economists and the people promoting it admits to that) and thus give billions to land lords and property owners. But I guess that's a feature, not a bug?
  - CryptoPunk 5y ago
    Rent control makes housing less affordable for the common man. This is the near-unanimous conclusion of economists, who have studied this issue for upwards of a century. Rent control makes housing less affordable than it would otherwise be in Europe too.
    - cloudfifty 5y ago
      This is simply false. Maybe economists models of an optimal market somehow shows that. But on the ground facts refute it without a shadow of a doubt. One cause of this is usually that government involvement in the production of housing is assumed to be out of the question by those economists. People are not stupid. Why do you think there's so much resistance in Europe towards market based rents if they think it will actually lower their rents? Should people be thrown out of their apartment they've lived in their whole life just because the property owner can find someone wealthier that's willing to pay more? How is that a desired outcome for the common man? People would rather want that the housing is created by the state than have that crazily class based stratification of our cities.
      - CryptoPunk 5y ago
        You're saying that a belief that has near total consensus among the experts is "simply false". You clearly haven't examined the evidence on rent control, and are simply making assumptions to avoid having to contend with the possibility that your preconceived notion is wrong. >>Why do you think there's so much resistance in Europe towards market based rents if they think it will actually lower their rents? 1. Because economics is a difficult subject to understand, made all the more difficult by the multitude of special interests who need to discredit economics in order to rationalize the anti-free-market impositions that provide them with rent-seeking opportunities like subsidies and artificially suppressed rent. 2. Because people who already have rent-controlled units in high-demand cities don't want to give up their privilege for the benefit of the people of the nation at large, who, by virtue of rent control starving the housing sector of the capital to build more units in those cities, miss out on the opportunity to find a unit in the high-demand cities. >>Should people be thrown out of their apartment they've lived in their whole life just because the property owner can find someone wealthier that's willing to pay more? YES! They're renters. If they want the stability of not having to ever worry about housing costs increasing, they need to buy their own units. They can't rent, and then expect the stability of being an owner. We need to be giving housing in the highest-in-demand localities to the people who can make the best use of it economically, which would be those who are willing and able to pay the most for it. We also need to be giving investors the incentive to invest in new housing in these highest-in-demand localities so that more people can live in them, and that requires allowing rental rates to reflect the supply/demand dynamics. This is basic economics.