8 ms·

I belief only a small % of people can be healthy without eating meat. It’s anecdotal but too many stories of devote vegans who fall ill after years and miraculo

by vimy 5y ago

I belief only a small % of people can be healthy without eating meat. It’s anecdotal but too many stories of devote vegans who fall ill after years and miraculously recover after eating meat again. A common argument is they must have done something wrong but I don’t buy it.

colordrops 5y ago
Well that's the problem - you are basing your belief on anecdote and gut feeling. The actual science behind this is overwhelming - there is nothing wrong with a vegan diet. You won't be able to find much that states otherwise. Beans and whole grains can provide all essential amino acids despite propaganda stating otherwise. Even meat eaters don't get enough B12 and should supplement, because B12 comes from the food animals eat, and their feed is insufficient. If you don't just eat Oreos and white rice, you should be fine as a vegan. The propaganda against veganism will eventually be seen as how the cigarette industry sold cigarettes as healthy.
- rantwasp 5y ago
  nope. Eating a 100% vegan diet without taking any supplements and without having access to a great nutritionist will make you have a bad time. It’s stupid hard to get all the nutrients you need without meat and you need to be in a privileged position to start with to do this successfully.
  - colordrops 5y ago
    Do you have any references? Other than supplementation of B12, which meat eaters should do as well, there is no scientific evidence that "it's stupid hard" and you need a nutritionist. In fact, the only thing you need to know is to eat plenty of whole grains, legumes, and green vegetables and you WILL get your needed nutrients and proteins. Prove otherwise please - which nutritional requirements would not be met?
    - rantwasp 5y ago
      posted some references in here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28028126 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28028126 also, start with this and do a bit of research: https://michaelkummer.com/health/plants-vs-meat/ https://michaelkummer.com/health/plants-vs-meat/
      - colordrops 5y ago
        Scientific studies would be better sources of information than articles. In any case, the evolutionary discussions are not an argument for modern diets, for obvious reasons. The only thing with any merit in the links you posted is about DHA. Your body CAN produce it from plant sources, but if you must insist on taking DHA, it comes from algae, and there are algal sources. Animal sources get it from algae as well. If you are suggesting nutricional deficiencies due to DHA you need to provide real references indicating that, and not general articles on the nutritional profiles of meat vs vegetables that make vague associations with health outcomes.
        rantwasp 5y ago
        you missed the 2nd part: access to a nutritionist or have a lot of knowledge about nutrition yourself. there is no way average joe can figure all these things out on a limited budget + limited time evolutionary considerations are a part if everything. you cannot ignore how you got here and biology
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        colordrops 5y ago
        If you want to look at health outcomes, the average diet of the nutritionally ignorant is almost always going to be worse than a vegan diet, ignorantly planned or not. The majority of the US populace (mostly meat eating) is very unhealthy and sick due to nutritional ignorance, so this is a very weak argument. Furthermore, meat is a known carcinogen and inflammatory. Its absurd to me that health reasons are attempted to be used as an argument against plant based diets. To be frank, using the argument that plant based diets are "privileged" is cynical and disingenuous.
- vimy 5y ago
  The science, like the science saying fat and cholesterol are bad for you. > Even meat eaters don't get enough B12 and should supplement, because B12 comes from the food animals eat, and their feed is insufficient. Nope. Not having enough B12 is a rare condition. > If you don't just eat Oreos and white rice, you should be fine as a vegan. And yet, even vegan influencers get sick and start to eat meat again. And the argument is always “they must have done something wrong”.
  - colordrops 5y ago
    Some vague notion about "vegan influencers" getting sick is the reason people shouldn't stop eating meat? Really?
    - vimy 5y ago
      Vegans are deficit in b12: http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaneurology/fullarticle/784788https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16219987 http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaneurology/fullarticle/78... High fiber diets reduce serum half life of vitamin D3: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6299329 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6299329 Vegans have weaker bones due to lower calcium intake and vitamin D3 levels: http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/fullarticle/486478 http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/fullart... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21092700 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21092700 Vegans have a worse memory compared to non vegans due to creatine deficiency in vegans: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21118604 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21118604 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14561278 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14561278 Vegans have less gains compared to non vegans: http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/70/6/1032.full http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/70/6/1032.full Vegans are deficient in omega threes: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16087975 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16087975 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16188209 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16188209 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323090 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323090 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323085 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323085 Vegans are deficit in carnitine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21753065 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21753065 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2756917 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2756917 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1628441/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1628441/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11043928 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11043928 Vegans are deficient in taurine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3354491 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3354491 Vegans are deficient in iodine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12748410 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12748410 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21613354 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21613354 Vegans are deficient in Coenzyme Q10: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16873950 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16873950 Vegans are deficient in iron due to the fact that iron from plant sources is less bioavailable than iron from meat sources: https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11269606 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11269606 Vegans are deficient in vitamin A: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19103647 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19103647 http://m.jn.nutrition.org/content/137/11/2346.full http://m.jn.nutrition.org/content/137/11/2346.full http://healthybabycode.com/why-you-cant-get-vitamin-a-from-eating-vegetables http://healthybabycode.com/why-you-cant-get-vitamin-a-from-e... (studies linked in the article) https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091118072051.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091118072051.h... http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/betacarotene.htm http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/betacarotene.htm http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/71/6/1545.full http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/71/6/1545.full http://www.fasebj.org/content/23/4/1041.full http://www.fasebj.org/content/23/4/1041.full http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/beta-carotene-vitamin-a-myth http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/beta-carotene-vitamin... http://empoweredsustenance.com/true-vitamin-a-foods http://empoweredsustenance.com/true-vitamin-a-foods https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition/vitamin-a-vagary https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition... https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition/vitamin-a-saga https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition... https://philmaffetone.com/vitamin-a-and-the-beta-carotene-myth https://philmaffetone.com/vitamin-a-and-the-beta-carotene-my... Calcium in Rats https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3183773 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3183773 Magnesium and Oxalates https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15035687 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15035687 Vegans have a lower sperm count than non vegans: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/35465 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/35465 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257705/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257705/ Vegans have lower testosterone than non vegans: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1435181 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1435181 http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/42/1/127.abstract http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/42/1/127.abstract https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/159772 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/159772 http://m.jap.physiology.org/content/82/1/49 http://m.jap.physiology.org/content/82/1/49 Veganism causes loss of libido and erectile dysfunction: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21353476 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21353476 Children who are raised on strict vegan diets do not grow normally: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4067152 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4067152 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8005079 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8005079 Children develop rickets after prolonged periods of strict vegetarian diets: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1874810/pdf/canmedaj01383-0052.pdf http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1874810/pdf/canm... "There are some links between vegetarians and lower birthweight and earlier labour" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7788369 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7788369 Most recent studies using more sensitive techniques for detecting B12 deficiency have found that 68% of vegetarians and 83% of vegans are B12 deficient, compared to just 5% off omnivores. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12816782 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12816782 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10966896 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10966896 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10552882 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10552882 --------------------------------- These are case studies: Cerebral atrophy in a vitamin B12-deficient infant of a vegetarian mother: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25076673 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25076673 Severe megaloblastic anemia in child breast fed by a vegetarian mother: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8442642 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8442642 Consequences of exclusive breast-feeding in vegan mother newborn - case report: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19748244 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19748244 Nutritional vitamin B12 deficiency in a breast-fed infant of a vegan-diet mother: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3948463 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3948463 "We report the case of a 7 month-old girl that presented with acute anemia, generalized muscular hypotonia and failure to thrive. Laboratory evaluation revealed cobalamin deficiency, due to a vegan diet of the mother." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18293883 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18293883

by vimy 5y ago

colordrops 5y ago

Well that's the problem - you are basing your belief on anecdote and gut feeling. The actual science behind this is overwhelming - there is nothing wrong with a vegan diet. You won't be able to find much that states otherwise. Beans and whole grains can provide all essential amino acids despite propaganda stating otherwise. Even meat eaters don't get enough B12 and should supplement, because B12 comes from the food animals eat, and their feed is insufficient. If you don't just eat Oreos and white rice, you should be fine as a vegan. The propaganda against veganism will eventually be seen as how the cigarette industry sold cigarettes as healthy.

rantwasp 5y ago
nope. Eating a 100% vegan diet without taking any supplements and without having access to a great nutritionist will make you have a bad time. It’s stupid hard to get all the nutrients you need without meat and you need to be in a privileged position to start with to do this successfully.
- colordrops 5y ago
  Do you have any references? Other than supplementation of B12, which meat eaters should do as well, there is no scientific evidence that "it's stupid hard" and you need a nutritionist. In fact, the only thing you need to know is to eat plenty of whole grains, legumes, and green vegetables and you WILL get your needed nutrients and proteins. Prove otherwise please - which nutritional requirements would not be met?
  - rantwasp 5y ago
    posted some references in here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28028126 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28028126 also, start with this and do a bit of research: https://michaelkummer.com/health/plants-vs-meat/ https://michaelkummer.com/health/plants-vs-meat/
    - colordrops 5y ago
      Scientific studies would be better sources of information than articles. In any case, the evolutionary discussions are not an argument for modern diets, for obvious reasons. The only thing with any merit in the links you posted is about DHA. Your body CAN produce it from plant sources, but if you must insist on taking DHA, it comes from algae, and there are algal sources. Animal sources get it from algae as well. If you are suggesting nutricional deficiencies due to DHA you need to provide real references indicating that, and not general articles on the nutritional profiles of meat vs vegetables that make vague associations with health outcomes.
      - rantwasp 5y ago
        you missed the 2nd part: access to a nutritionist or have a lot of knowledge about nutrition yourself. there is no way average joe can figure all these things out on a limited budget + limited time evolutionary considerations are a part if everything. you cannot ignore how you got here and biology
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        colordrops 5y ago
        If you want to look at health outcomes, the average diet of the nutritionally ignorant is almost always going to be worse than a vegan diet, ignorantly planned or not. The majority of the US populace (mostly meat eating) is very unhealthy and sick due to nutritional ignorance, so this is a very weak argument. Furthermore, meat is a known carcinogen and inflammatory. Its absurd to me that health reasons are attempted to be used as an argument against plant based diets. To be frank, using the argument that plant based diets are "privileged" is cynical and disingenuous.
vimy 5y ago
The science, like the science saying fat and cholesterol are bad for you. > Even meat eaters don't get enough B12 and should supplement, because B12 comes from the food animals eat, and their feed is insufficient. Nope. Not having enough B12 is a rare condition. > If you don't just eat Oreos and white rice, you should be fine as a vegan. And yet, even vegan influencers get sick and start to eat meat again. And the argument is always “they must have done something wrong”.
- colordrops 5y ago
  Some vague notion about "vegan influencers" getting sick is the reason people shouldn't stop eating meat? Really?
  - vimy 5y ago
    Vegans are deficit in b12: http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaneurology/fullarticle/784788https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16219987 http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaneurology/fullarticle/78... High fiber diets reduce serum half life of vitamin D3: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6299329 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6299329 Vegans have weaker bones due to lower calcium intake and vitamin D3 levels: http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/fullarticle/486478 http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/fullart... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21092700 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21092700 Vegans have a worse memory compared to non vegans due to creatine deficiency in vegans: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21118604 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21118604 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14561278 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14561278 Vegans have less gains compared to non vegans: http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/70/6/1032.full http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/70/6/1032.full Vegans are deficient in omega threes: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16087975 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16087975 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16188209 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16188209 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323090 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323090 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323085 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12323085 Vegans are deficit in carnitine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21753065 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21753065 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2756917 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2756917 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1628441/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1628441/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11043928 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11043928 Vegans are deficient in taurine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3354491 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3354491 Vegans are deficient in iodine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12748410 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12748410 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21613354 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21613354 Vegans are deficient in Coenzyme Q10: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16873950 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16873950 Vegans are deficient in iron due to the fact that iron from plant sources is less bioavailable than iron from meat sources: https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11269606 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11269606 Vegans are deficient in vitamin A: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19103647 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19103647 http://m.jn.nutrition.org/content/137/11/2346.full http://m.jn.nutrition.org/content/137/11/2346.full http://healthybabycode.com/why-you-cant-get-vitamin-a-from-eating-vegetables http://healthybabycode.com/why-you-cant-get-vitamin-a-from-e... (studies linked in the article) https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091118072051.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091118072051.h... http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/betacarotene.htm http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/betacarotene.htm http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/71/6/1545.full http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/71/6/1545.full http://www.fasebj.org/content/23/4/1041.full http://www.fasebj.org/content/23/4/1041.full http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/beta-carotene-vitamin-a-myth http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/beta-carotene-vitamin... http://empoweredsustenance.com/true-vitamin-a-foods http://empoweredsustenance.com/true-vitamin-a-foods https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition/vitamin-a-vagary https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition... https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition/vitamin-a-saga https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/abcs-of-nutrition... https://philmaffetone.com/vitamin-a-and-the-beta-carotene-myth https://philmaffetone.com/vitamin-a-and-the-beta-carotene-my... Calcium in Rats https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3183773 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3183773 Magnesium and Oxalates https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15035687 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15035687 Vegans have a lower sperm count than non vegans: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/35465 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/35465 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257705/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257705/ Vegans have lower testosterone than non vegans: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1435181 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1435181 http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/42/1/127.abstract http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/42/1/127.abstract https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/159772 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/159772 http://m.jap.physiology.org/content/82/1/49 http://m.jap.physiology.org/content/82/1/49 Veganism causes loss of libido and erectile dysfunction: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21353476 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21353476 Children who are raised on strict vegan diets do not grow normally: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4067152 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4067152 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8005079 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8005079 Children develop rickets after prolonged periods of strict vegetarian diets: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1874810/pdf/canmedaj01383-0052.pdf http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1874810/pdf/canm... "There are some links between vegetarians and lower birthweight and earlier labour" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7788369 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7788369 Most recent studies using more sensitive techniques for detecting B12 deficiency have found that 68% of vegetarians and 83% of vegans are B12 deficient, compared to just 5% off omnivores. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12816782 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12816782 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10966896 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10966896 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10552882 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10552882 --------------------------------- These are case studies: Cerebral atrophy in a vitamin B12-deficient infant of a vegetarian mother: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25076673 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25076673 Severe megaloblastic anemia in child breast fed by a vegetarian mother: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8442642 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8442642 Consequences of exclusive breast-feeding in vegan mother newborn - case report: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19748244 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19748244 Nutritional vitamin B12 deficiency in a breast-fed infant of a vegan-diet mother: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3948463 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3948463 "We report the case of a 7 month-old girl that presented with acute anemia, generalized muscular hypotonia and failure to thrive. Laboratory evaluation revealed cobalamin deficiency, due to a vegan diet of the mother." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18293883 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18293883