5 ms·

But why limit water

by hugg 5y ago

But why limit water

whitepaint 5y ago
Isn't it a private business that has to pay for utilities?
- Broken_Hippo 5y ago
  Seriously, giving folks water isn't going to make a noticable dent in the water bill, considering how much water is going to be used simply washing the restaurant during the day. The drink stations already have water there, and the ice machine often enough cools the beverages (so no extra cost).
  - whitepaint 5y ago
    But it's not only about paying for utilities. If you had a restaurant, would you want homeless people come in? We need to build public water fountains instead of expecting private enterprises to do charity.
    - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
      I'm smart enough to know that homeless people aren't bad folks, and that homelessness doesn't mean scaring customers away or even mean uncleanliness. Landscapers and other folks that get stinky, dirty, and sweaty are welcomed in. And I've "let" homeless folks into places I work before and given folks water. The McDonalds I've worked at did not charge for water. I'll also mention that water fountains aren't all that useful during winter.
  - yourenotsmart 5y ago
    Why don't you give folks water? It's not simply a matter of the water bill, but also what culture it promotes around their service, what customers (or "customers" in quotes) this attracts, how this affects other actual customers and so on. McDonald's have bought or rented the place, own the equipment, pay their staff, and pay taxes. They did all this to offer a specific service. You can take that service or leave it. They're not a public free water dispensers, or social services, or whatever role people are trying to impose on them.
    - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
      I am a person living in a house, and honestly could get water somewhere if I needed it. And if someone knocked on my door and said they needed a glass of water, I'd give it to them. I'll add that not all homeless folks look like your stereotypical homeless person that people think of, and I've seen folks get off work and be dirty and stinky... and they are allowed in all sorts of places (and do, indeed, come in, especially on lunch breaks) I've given folks water when I worked in places that had such things, and most food places I've worked at - including McDonalds - gave folks water if they asked for it. They aren't the only ones paying taxes, by the way. Not everyone who needs water are homeless, and a good deal of homeless folks
      - yourenotsmart 5y ago
        No one builds a RFID system because one guy really needed water that one time, can we at least be serious here? No one is discussing some hypothetical situation where someone knocks on your home, either. We're talking about a problem that's systematic, at volume, and persistent over time, and therefore qualitative change for McDonald's and the environment they offer to customers. McDonald's wanted to offer finite refills to paying customers. Their current system had a loophole with unintended consequences, so they closed that loophole. If you want to help homeless people I guess go work at McDonald's and give homeless people water when they ask, and everything will be perfect. But let's see if your ideals stay intact after 10 cups of water. 100 cups of water. 1000 cups of water. A million cups of water. It's very easy to say "oh I gave water to a dude once". I also gave water to a dude once, doesn't matter for McDonald's and people habitually coming back to leech a resource they provide that's not intended to be free in the first place.
quietbritishjim 5y ago
You might expect free basic water, what we in the UK would call "tap water". But that's not one of the options - the picture shows Dasani, which is a product that's marketed as a premium water competing with mineral water. I wouldn't expect to walk into a restaurant and get free mineral water, regardless of my housing situation. (In reality Dasani is just filtered tap water, and is infamous in the UK for ending up less pure than the tap water it started with and having to go through a huge product recall before they even released it. But, as silly as it is, it's still a paid product.)
- stefan_ 5y ago
  How does it work at McDonalds? Everything else is a syrup, but the water (sorry, dasani) is shipped and delivered as water? That doesn't seem likely.
  - quietbritishjim 5y ago
    Hmm, that's a good point. If it literally is just tap water with Dasani branding, it's like an implicit admission that Dasani in general is nothing more than tap water.
  - yourenotsmart 5y ago
    You think it's unlikely that water is packaged and shipped? What do you think bottled water is? Whether you think someone is cheating with tap water at the source is beside that point. Some do, some bigger brands don't as they have more to lose by cheating. But regardless, water gets packaged and shipped all the time. Your regular variety grocery store Coca Cola is also 90%+ tap water, bottled and shipped. They're not mixing syrup at the store.
    - quietbritishjim 5y ago
      > You think it's unlikely that water is packaged and shipped? You're refuting a different point than the one the parent comment made. They didn't claim that no water is ever shipped. They just claimed that these types of drinks machines don't work that way. > What do you think bottled water is? They weren't talking about bottled water, they were talking about this type of drink machine. Of course bottled water in a proper restaurant is shipped as such. It also usually arrives at your table in the bottle, partly so you know that it's not just tap water. > Whether you think someone is cheating with tap water at the source is beside that point. It's not besides the point at all. Actually it's completely central to the point. The comment chain you're replying to is precisely about whether people are being denied tap water, or some (supposedly) more premium product. If it's the latter, it completely invalidates the point of the original tweet. Plus it's interesting in its own right. If the makers of Dasani admit that it's indistinguishable from tap water, then that's very relevant to people buying it at a store to take home and drink instead of the tap water they already had access to! > Your regular variety grocery store Coca Cola is ... Now that actually is beside the point. If bottled Coca Cola is the same as tap water + Coca Cola syrup + fizz, then that's not really a surprise to anyone buying Coca Cola in either form.
dathinab 5y ago
I think in some EU countries it's actually required for free tap water to be provided, but - only for restaurants, idk. if McDonalds is classified as such - only on request, they can require you to queue up again.
- quietbritishjim 5y ago
  It's also typically only required that you give that tap water to customers paying for some other item (at least that's how it work here in the UK).
  - dathinab 5y ago
    Oh, yes good point, I forgot to mention that.
  - kapep 5y ago
    I was pleasantly surprised that in the UK the waiters proactively ask you if you want tap water with your meal. In Germany you have to explicitly ask for it and then often have to endure the waiter's annoyed reaction. On the other hand I was unpleasantly surprised with the taste of tap water in the UK.

But why limit water

by hugg 5y ago

But why limit water

whitepaint 5y ago

Isn't it a private business that has to pay for utilities?

Broken_Hippo 5y ago
Seriously, giving folks water isn't going to make a noticable dent in the water bill, considering how much water is going to be used simply washing the restaurant during the day. The drink stations already have water there, and the ice machine often enough cools the beverages (so no extra cost).
- whitepaint 5y ago
  But it's not only about paying for utilities. If you had a restaurant, would you want homeless people come in? We need to build public water fountains instead of expecting private enterprises to do charity.
  - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
    I'm smart enough to know that homeless people aren't bad folks, and that homelessness doesn't mean scaring customers away or even mean uncleanliness. Landscapers and other folks that get stinky, dirty, and sweaty are welcomed in. And I've "let" homeless folks into places I work before and given folks water. The McDonalds I've worked at did not charge for water. I'll also mention that water fountains aren't all that useful during winter.
- yourenotsmart 5y ago
  Why don't you give folks water? It's not simply a matter of the water bill, but also what culture it promotes around their service, what customers (or "customers" in quotes) this attracts, how this affects other actual customers and so on. McDonald's have bought or rented the place, own the equipment, pay their staff, and pay taxes. They did all this to offer a specific service. You can take that service or leave it. They're not a public free water dispensers, or social services, or whatever role people are trying to impose on them.
  - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
    I am a person living in a house, and honestly could get water somewhere if I needed it. And if someone knocked on my door and said they needed a glass of water, I'd give it to them. I'll add that not all homeless folks look like your stereotypical homeless person that people think of, and I've seen folks get off work and be dirty and stinky... and they are allowed in all sorts of places (and do, indeed, come in, especially on lunch breaks) I've given folks water when I worked in places that had such things, and most food places I've worked at - including McDonalds - gave folks water if they asked for it. They aren't the only ones paying taxes, by the way. Not everyone who needs water are homeless, and a good deal of homeless folks
    - yourenotsmart 5y ago
      No one builds a RFID system because one guy really needed water that one time, can we at least be serious here? No one is discussing some hypothetical situation where someone knocks on your home, either. We're talking about a problem that's systematic, at volume, and persistent over time, and therefore qualitative change for McDonald's and the environment they offer to customers. McDonald's wanted to offer finite refills to paying customers. Their current system had a loophole with unintended consequences, so they closed that loophole. If you want to help homeless people I guess go work at McDonald's and give homeless people water when they ask, and everything will be perfect. But let's see if your ideals stay intact after 10 cups of water. 100 cups of water. 1000 cups of water. A million cups of water. It's very easy to say "oh I gave water to a dude once". I also gave water to a dude once, doesn't matter for McDonald's and people habitually coming back to leech a resource they provide that's not intended to be free in the first place.

quietbritishjim 5y ago

You might expect free basic water, what we in the UK would call "tap water". But that's not one of the options - the picture shows Dasani, which is a product that's marketed as a premium water competing with mineral water. I wouldn't expect to walk into a restaurant and get free mineral water, regardless of my housing situation. (In reality Dasani is just filtered tap water, and is infamous in the UK for ending up less pure than the tap water it started with and having to go through a huge product recall before they even released it. But, as silly as it is, it's still a paid product.)

stefan_ 5y ago
How does it work at McDonalds? Everything else is a syrup, but the water (sorry, dasani) is shipped and delivered as water? That doesn't seem likely.
- quietbritishjim 5y ago
  Hmm, that's a good point. If it literally is just tap water with Dasani branding, it's like an implicit admission that Dasani in general is nothing more than tap water.
- yourenotsmart 5y ago
  You think it's unlikely that water is packaged and shipped? What do you think bottled water is? Whether you think someone is cheating with tap water at the source is beside that point. Some do, some bigger brands don't as they have more to lose by cheating. But regardless, water gets packaged and shipped all the time. Your regular variety grocery store Coca Cola is also 90%+ tap water, bottled and shipped. They're not mixing syrup at the store.
  - quietbritishjim 5y ago
    > You think it's unlikely that water is packaged and shipped? You're refuting a different point than the one the parent comment made. They didn't claim that no water is ever shipped. They just claimed that these types of drinks machines don't work that way. > What do you think bottled water is? They weren't talking about bottled water, they were talking about this type of drink machine. Of course bottled water in a proper restaurant is shipped as such. It also usually arrives at your table in the bottle, partly so you know that it's not just tap water. > Whether you think someone is cheating with tap water at the source is beside that point. It's not besides the point at all. Actually it's completely central to the point. The comment chain you're replying to is precisely about whether people are being denied tap water, or some (supposedly) more premium product. If it's the latter, it completely invalidates the point of the original tweet. Plus it's interesting in its own right. If the makers of Dasani admit that it's indistinguishable from tap water, then that's very relevant to people buying it at a store to take home and drink instead of the tap water they already had access to! > Your regular variety grocery store Coca Cola is ... Now that actually is beside the point. If bottled Coca Cola is the same as tap water + Coca Cola syrup + fizz, then that's not really a surprise to anyone buying Coca Cola in either form.

dathinab 5y ago

I think in some EU countries it's actually required for free tap water to be provided, but - only for restaurants, idk. if McDonalds is classified as such - only on request, they can require you to queue up again.

quietbritishjim 5y ago
It's also typically only required that you give that tap water to customers paying for some other item (at least that's how it work here in the UK).
- dathinab 5y ago
  Oh, yes good point, I forgot to mention that.
- kapep 5y ago
  I was pleasantly surprised that in the UK the waiters proactively ask you if you want tap water with your meal. In Germany you have to explicitly ask for it and then often have to endure the waiter's annoyed reaction. On the other hand I was unpleasantly surprised with the taste of tap water in the UK.